Comments on: GORDON DUFF: “COLLATERAL DAMAGE,” SPINNING AWAY MURDER IN IRAQ

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By: Paul VanGogh

Paul VanGogh — Tue, 13 Apr 2010 19:33:22 +0000

Yes/L.B.J. sure has seemed one. One particular book which was recounted to me says it loud and clear. A book by a couple of Dems.

I myself am not, CERTAINLY, biased vs the Dems.:) He wasn’t all there. A few reporters who flipped because of his beagles’-ears stunt were, actually, reacting to something they sensed in his character.

J.F.K. IMO liked him. In high places I think that trait tends to be overlooked

By: Gordon Duff

Gordon Duff — Sun, 11 Apr 2010 16:54:32 +0000

Nelson,
If we use the standards set by us at Nuremberg, then thousands of Americans face arrest. I barely escape that myself, I hope. OK, I seem to have misunderstood you. I suspect we may all have a bit of raging PTSD. It is probably time to start writing about correcting the collective mental illness that some of our miltiary seem to have. As a journalist, I am not free to do my job, not in today’s atmosphere. As a military retiree, it is not acceptable to misuse access to write about troops when a guest of a military installation.
I watched the movie Green Zone last night. Watching troops in Iraq (some fighting, some poolside….same same with Vietnam) cheering the draft dodging war criminal cretin, Bush, made me sick. Do we really have people that utterly stupid defending our country…if you want to call it that? I do love our kids but I raised mine to think for themselves. I am having a hard time accepting that normal americans serving in the military can become criminals. It isn’t supposed to be our way.
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By: Nelson_2008

Nelson_2008 — Sun, 11 Apr 2010 16:46:50 +0000

Gordon I actually do know something about “International Law”. Quite a bit in fact; maybe even more than you. But I wasn’t talking about that (frankly it’s only “words on paper” anyway, and it’s now clearly been replaced by “might makes right”).

Nor was I talking about “rules of engagement” (if you want to talk about “rules”, then let’s start with the UN Charter, the highest treaty in the world, under which the Iraq war itself is of course completely illegal). I find it pointless to talk about “rules” in a completely illegal war, since every Iraqi killed as a result, even those killed in the act of resisting, was murdered.

I was talking about what happened here in a moral context. My point was that the U.S. Military has, by design, completely degenerated into a political hit squad, and our Rulers’ goal is to populate it with completely amoral or immoral people (if that’s a distinction worth making).

The new mission of the U.S. military is simply to slaughter and subject politically incorrect people (same objective as the IDF), whether they be Arabs/Moslems, “unfriendly” Journalists, or even their own members, e.g., Pat Tillman, should they happen to develop a conscience or show signs of independent thought.

By: Gordon Duff

Gordon Duff — Sun, 11 Apr 2010 14:33:21 +0000

Nelson,
Ok, you are good at some stuff.
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By: Gordon Duff

Gordon Duff — Sun, 11 Apr 2010 13:43:27 +0000

Nelson,
The rules of engagement state that those who can’t be identified as enemy can’t be killed. The initial group attacked were reporters and community leaders with police authorized security carrying weapons authorized. They were not enemy but rather US paid militia members in a region where they belonged serving as such.
Your assumptions about the second group are fearful. You have no idea of international law, the nature of war crimes, our official rules of engagement or law in Iraq. I know all of these.
We do need to look at a couple of things, however. One, of course, is that I want you better informed. This makes the discussions work better.
Then….yes..why is it leaked now? Is it tied to the massive problem we are having with Israel? Wikileaks is a Chinese group.
Start looking at this…why are so many groups in the US being trashed in the news. If this was the military, who told them to do this? We have all seen video showing the real rules of engagement and this is not one of them….or are these the real rules…illegal…meant to destabilize iraq and damn the US? There is a game here. It is for us to figure it out.As for “the troops”….we are the troops. I am one of the troops. I don’t want anyone in uniform that lacks common sense. These were some really dumb shits…and those who invented stories to cover it up…need jail time. Read the cover stories…the total lies made up to keep the public from learning 2 helicopters did this. Where is the video from the second Apache?
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By: Nelson_2008

Nelson_2008 — Sun, 11 Apr 2010 06:00:52 +0000

So many people seem completely unable to connect the dots. Let me try to put it all together:

On 09/11/2001, Israel, with help from some carefully placed traitors in high places in the “U.S. government”, murdered 3000 people on U.S. soil, in an intricate, high-tech false-flag terror attack officially blamed on Arabs/Moslems.

The “U.S. government” traitors then used this false-flag terror attack as a pretext to start several illegal, immoral, totally senseless wars of aggression, against people in foreign lands that didn’t do anything to us; all in accordance with a pre-existing Zionist agenda known as the “PNAC” agenda.

The PNAC wars have already killed over a million innocent people and threaten yet millions more.

Moreover, the PNAC wars are being prosecuted at the expense of literally trillions of dollars in present and future costs, thereby squandering a significant portion of the world’s wealth on senseless brutality, while our domestic infrastructure crumbles and the value of our currency collapses.

The traitors in high places in the “U.S. government” also used this false-flag terror attack as an excuse to gut the Constitution, begin a massive domestic spying program, create torture camps (and fill them with innocent people), and generally engage in any and all kinds of lawlessness and violence, anywhere and everywhere, against anyone and everyone they please, all under the aegis of a laughably-absurd fraud known as the “Global War on Terror”.

The traitors in high places in the U.S. government are now using all their political power to prevent any kind of real investigation into exactly what happened on 09/11/2001.

In their efforts to conceal their culpability and prevent any accountability whatsoever, the traitors in high places in the U.S. government have debased and disgraced, for example, the Pentagon, FBI, CIA, FEMA and NIST.

The traitors in high places in the U.S. government simply cannot afford to have anyone with any moral scruples in any position of authority…IOW they don’t want honest people in government, they want scum bags…they want “people” just like themselves.

It is in this pathetic context that the “collateral murders” in Iraq have to be viewed. The “soldiers” who murdered these Iraqis are precisely the type of “people” the modern “U.S. military” needs; because, you see, it’s not really the U.S. military anymore but merely a criminal gang of Zionist crusaders.

Our government (to the extent it ever actually was “ours” in the first place), has now been completely overthrown from within.

The day is coming when our Masters will be depending on “the Troops” to protect them from the enraged citizenry.

By: Gordon Duff

Gordon Duff — Sun, 11 Apr 2010 05:40:38 +0000

XENO,
The Army briefed the press and told them they say RPG 29s. Not only that, they said they had been shot at the helicopters many times and that there was a large firefight with American troops. Hey, good try, though. Start reading the stories on this and make sure you see the MSNBC video. RPG 29, 105mm and almost 6 feet long. Maybe the little girls had them in their underwear?
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By: Gordon Duff

Gordon Duff — Sun, 11 Apr 2010 05:37:02 +0000

XENO
Not reality based, hell, not even rational. If you think the Jews killed all those people, I can assure you, there are very few Jews in the American military. They were more likely killed by a gang of homosexuals.
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By: Blackcoat

Blackcoat — Sun, 11 Apr 2010 04:57:47 +0000

What I heard and what I saw in the video allows me to make the following statement. The crew of the attack helicopter gave the “cleared to fire” agency information and asked to engage the people on the ground. The permission to engage the people on the ground was granted. To the crew of the attack helicopter the enemy were armed with what they assumed were weapons. The people on the ground were engaged and in the process all were killed except one and he was wounded and laying on the ground. A van rolled up to pick up the wounded man who for all intents and purposes was an enemy combatant according to the granting of clearance to engage. The wounded enemy was in the original count of X amount of combatants. Where does it say, in the Rules of Engagement, that those that assist the enemy cannot be killed? Because the enemy is wounded does not give him a free pass and all of a sudden he is deemed a friendly and innocent bystander. That is what happened. If one want to argue that the men that were engaged were not enemy that, in my opinion, is an entirely different subject for
discussion.
Do I feel that the conduct of the crew who did the killing was out of order? Absolutely not! Have some of us not realized that it is a combat zone? “War is hell, but Combat is a Mutha—-er!” Semper Fidelis. Blackcoat.

By: Blackcoat

Blackcoat — Sun, 11 Apr 2010 03:30:55 +0000

The opening sentence says plenty about what is really going on with the give away of billions of dollars with not one iota of oversight. “Lawmakers in Congress are beginning to grow concerned about cash being distributed by American commanders in war zones.” What is it with these 535 wishy-washy leeches in the U.S. Senate and House of Representatives? We are not talking about peanuts here. We are talking about $1,000,000,000 per year. Imagine what could have been done with that amount of money to give a larger pay raise to the active duty troops. (3.9% in 2010 and 1.4% in 2011). You know the troops that are putting their life on the line and are pulling multi-tours in the combat zone. This is not a liberal nor conservative issue, and until we, the people, and until we treat this as an issue of importance rather than “my political party has it right, it it the fault of the other political party” we will continue to be shit on because we allow them to shit on us. Semper Fidelis. Blackcoat.

By: Xeno P Hobic

Xeno P Hobic — Sun, 11 Apr 2010 03:20:38 +0000

Actually I think he thought it was this:

http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/land/smaw-c1.jpg

By: Xeno P Hobic

Xeno P Hobic — Sun, 11 Apr 2010 02:36:14 +0000

They were traveling in a combat zone. They knew the possible consequences of being mistaken for combatants. Wrong place at the wrong time. Happens to the best of us sometimes. You can’t take it too hard. Life is cruel. They were in the cruelest of worlds at the cruelest of times. That’s the way it is. If you step into a meat grinder don’t be surprised if you end up being ground up. I feel very sorry for them and very sorry for the people who made the mistake of shooting them, even, if indeed it was a mistake. But for the proverbial boy who cried wolf. I don’t believe anything that comes out of that area of the World. They are the World’s masters of propaganda and deception.

By: Paul crater

Paul crater — Sun, 11 Apr 2010 01:36:11 +0000

So – - i am guessing that if i were to sail over to america with 1 barrel of oil onboard and i am navigating with a telescope pointed towards the US coastline, that at the first sight of a helicopter i should evacuate my family from below decks and jump overboard ? ?
Maybe the worst collateral damage the US war has generated is the current attitude and apathy that the next generations will need to understand in order that they can learn how to better survive in an American world that is self imploding.
Remember none of us were born stupid – - some of us just forgot to learn.

By: mrg

mrg — Sat, 10 Apr 2010 21:30:22 +0000

Holy Crapola, only in america would we outsource the goddamn conflict. corporate profits first, human rights a “dead” last.

By: Lese Majeste

Lese Majeste — Fri, 09 Apr 2010 08:52:44 +0000

The particularly sick portion of that video was when the gunship crew laughed about shredding humans into hamburger, then cackled again when doing the same to those coming to their rescue.

Who in the hell was pulling the trigger, Beavis and Butthead?

When a person goes crazy, they usually get committed to a mental hospital.

What do you do when an entire nation has gone completely nuts?

By: Gordon Duff

Gordon Duff — Thu, 08 Apr 2010 13:36:43 +0000

I have friends with TC.
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By: Gordon Duff

Gordon Duff — Thu, 08 Apr 2010 13:36:20 +0000

Joel,
If you watched the video, the “Pentagon embedded” journalist, the one who had been briefed by them for the interview mentioned “RPG 29s…which can penetrate armor”…and…”thought to be carried in the camera bags”
This was a briefed Pentagon spokesman.
Joel, you have to raise the bar when playing with lying bloodsuckers. You failed to pay attention to, not the video that wasn’t posted but the one that was. The article was about Pentagon spin. Also, of course, try putting an RPG 7 in a camera bag. You also know nothing about guns. The effective range of a 762.39 is about 300 yards and the 5.56 is aboutr 500 yards. I use 7.62 54 or 55 for ranges about 500 meters. An AK has no buffer group, underpowered ammo and is an ineffective weapon at range. Some of us do this crap for a living.
The Apache has an ultra-high resolution optical camera in the pod above and two FLIR, front looking infared cameras which, if used at night, could have seen the kids in the van.
Rules of engagement state that if you cant see weapons and people, you can’t shoot. Neither were ever seen or mentioned. You are also indicating that you know the loadout on the Apache’s. Sorry to tell you this, but General Dynamics loves selling DU and the area around Baghdad is loaded with it. Unless you were the armourer on these Apache’s…and there were at least two…
Think of this also…we don’t have the video from the second Apache nor do we have their audio…which makes this far worse.
Start paying attention. You have an assignment. go back and watch the video. Then do a google search on who is in it. Outline what was said. See if you don’t hear the term “RPG 29″
“bitchy rant with some poetry”…funny.
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