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JFK: What We Know Now that We didn’t Know Then

by  Jim Fetzer

 

The alleged assassin of JFK

With the advent of the 48th observance of the assassination of President John F. Kennedy, it may be appropriate to share important findings regarding what we know now about his death that we have not known in the past. Most Americans are not in the position to take on the task that serious research requires.

As a former Marine Corps officer and professor of philosophy who taught logic, critical thinking, and scientific reasoning for 35 years, it was my privilege to organize a research group consisting of the best qualified individuals to ever study the case in 1992.

Since then, we have published three books reporting what we have discovered – Assassination Science (1998), Murder in Dealey Plaza (2000), and The Great Zapruder Film Hoax (2003) — I have chaired or co-chaired four national meetings on this subject and produced a documentary on it.

From these books and other sources I will cite, many available on the net, you can verify what I am saying about our findings.

This research group–whose efforts continue to this day–has included three M.D.s, one of whom attended the mortally wounded president and then, two days later, his alleged assassin, while the second was a world authority on the human brain and also an expert on wound ballistics.

The third is both a Ph.D. in physics and board-certified in radiation oncology, who has studied the autopsy X-rays in the National Archives and is the leading expert on the medical evidence. A second Ph.D. in physics, with a specialization in the properties of light and of images of moving objects, is the foremost authority on the Zapruder film in the world today. 

Others include an expert on the JFK photos and films, who testified before the House Select Committee on Assassinations when it reinvestigated the case in 1977-78, another an expert on the production/post-production of films and the technology available to alter them in November 1963, where the third Ph.D. is a philosopher of science who has published 29 books.

The hole in the windshield (1), the man in the doorway (2), the Dal-Tex shooter's location (3), and LBJ's security already reacting at the same time JFK's detail is looking around and non-responsive (4)

Among the enduring controversies of JFK research has been the identity of the man in the doorway, whom many believe to be Lee Oswald.  Oliver Stone studied this question in preparing his film, “JFK”, and concluded that it was Billy Lovelady instead, a co-worker at the depository.

Documents newly released by the ARRB, the interview notes taken by Will Fritz, the homicide detective who interrogated Oswald, however, show that Lee told him he had been “out with Bill Shelly [the assistant manager of the Texas School Book Depository] in front” during the assassination.

And, indeed, if you look more closely, you can see that the face of a man who is to the left/front of Lovelady (to the right/front facing him) has been damaged in order to conceal the presence of the alleged “lone assassin”.  

While the Altgens has widely been supposed to be untouched, this discovery demonstrates that that is not the case. Indeed, another figure two persons to Lovelady’s right (or to his left facing him) has also been obscured, whom I would surmise was probably Jack Ruby.

This discovery demonstrates that proof that Oswald was framed, which includes the faking of the backyard photographs, is simply overwhelming and far beyond any reasonable doubt.

Lovelady to the left, Oswald to his right/front (defaced)

Will Fritz handwitten notes

If we use the phrase “beyond a reasonable doubt” to characterize arguments based upon logic and evidence for which there is no reasonable alternative explanation, then what we have published in these books and recent articles demonstrates beyond reasonable doubt:

* that JFK was hit at least four times (once in the back from behind; once in the throat from in front; and twice in the head, once from behind and once from in front);

* that the wound to his throat was caused by a shot that penetrated the limousine windshield, which was subsequently destroyed and replaced by a substitute windshield;

* that the shot to the back was well below the collar, entered only about as far as the second knuckle on your little finger, and evinced no point of exit from the body;

Will Fritz notes typed

* that no bullet transited the President’s neck without hitting any bony structures and exited at the level of his tie, a trajectory that in fact turns out to be anatomically impossible;

* that, as a consequence, no bullet passed through the President and hit the Governor, who was hit by at least one and perhaps as many as two or even three separate shots;

* that, including the shot that missed and injured James Tague, an absolute minimum of six shots had to have been fired during the assassination, where the total was more likely eight, nine, or even ten;

* that at least 59 witnesses reported that the limousine slowed dramatically or came to a complete halt after bullets began to be fired, which supports the conclusion that it slowed dramatically as it came to a complete halt;

No hits were fired from the 6th floor "sniper's lair"

* that the first shot to the head was fired from behind and entered in the vicinity of the external occipital protuberance at the back of the head;

* that the second shot to the head was fired from in front and entered in the vicinity of the right temple;

* that this second shot was fired with a frangible or “exploding” bullet that transmitted shockwaves through the brain;

* that the impact of this bullet combined with the weakening of the skull by the first shot to the head caused 1/3 to 1/2 of his brains to be blown out in Dealey Plaza at the time;

* that the massive blow-out to the back of the head was concealed by imposing a “patch” to the right lateral cranial X-ray (of the skull taken from the right side);

He was said to have rushed from the 6th floor to the lunch room in order to drink a coke

* that the brain had to be reconstituted since, once the defect to the skull had been “patched”, there was no place for that brain matter to have gone;

* that the brain shown in diagrams and photographs in the National Archives cannot be the brain of John Fitzgerald Kennedy;

* that two brain examinations were conducted, the first of which was with the President’s brain, the second with a substitute;

* that the autopsy report was prepared without the benefit of the autopsy photographs, which were removed by the Secret Service;

* that the photographs were subsequently altered and altered in various ways to conceal evidence of the cause of death;

* that the Zapruder film of the assassination was in the hands of the National Photographic Interpretation Center (NPIC) run by the CIA already the weekend of the assassination;

But witnesses saw him in and around the 2nd floor lunchroom

* that the extant “Zapruder film” has been massively edited to remove evidence of the actual cause of death, including the limousine having been brought to a halt in order to insure that the target would be killed.

A very accessible overview of these findings was presented at a national conference held at the University of North Dakota and published as Chapter 30, “Dealey Plaza Revisited: What Happened to JFK?” The studies by David W. Mantik, M.D., Ph.D., on the autopsy X-rays have been supplemented by his presentation, “The JFK Skull X-rays: Evidence for Forgery” at a national conference in Dallas in 2009.

A visual tutorial introduction to the evidence that the Zapruder film has been recreated by John P. Costella, Ph.D., “The JFK Assassination Film Hoax” , explains how we know that the film is a fabrication.

That finding that has been reinforced by the publication by Douglas Horne, the Chief Analyst for Military Affairs for the Assassination Records Review Board, of Inside the ARRB (2009), whose key arguments about the film are summarized in an article for those who may not have time for all five volumes!

Many related articles are also archived at http://assassinationscience.com and http://assassinationresearch.com .

His 1:40 PM arrest report convicted him without the benefit of any investigation

Most of these findings were published in Murder in Dealey Plaza (2000), which benefited from the release of the first of some 60,000 documents and records that were meant to be withheld from the public by the Warren Commission for 75 years.

Those whose work is brought together in this volume include the leading authority on the Secret Service (Vincent Palamara); the most knowledgeable student of the Presidential limousine (Douglas Weldon, J.D.); a leading expert on the medical evidence at Parkland and at Bethesda (Gary Aguilar, M.D.); the single most highly qualified person to ever study this case (David W. Mantik, M.D., Ph.D.); the Senior Analyst for Military Records for the ARRB (Douglas Horne); a legendary photo-analyst who advised the HSCA during its reinvestigation (Jack White); a world-famous philosopher who received the Nobel Prize for Literature in 1950 (Bertrand Russell); a prize-winning director and playwright, who has produced a brilliant chronology (Ira David Wood III); and a philosopher of science who had then published more than 20 books and 100 articles (James H. Fetzer, Ph.D.).

Given the extraordinary character of these findings, it would be appropriate to provide reasons beyond the research itself that was published there to reassure the public that it should be taken seriously.

Fortunately, this book was reviewed by George Costello for The Federal Lawyer (May 2001), pp. 52-56. This journal (formerly: The Federal Bar News and Journal) is a publication for attorneys who work for the federal government, who practice before federal agencies, or who appear before federal courts.

There were no nitrate residues on his face

The reviewer was honored with an award of recognition for this review of Murder in Dealey Plaza , which suggests his professional colleagues appreciated the contribution he made, which, in part, he summarized as follows: 

What does all of this mean? Any one of the findings summarized above would be troubling by itself.

Together, these findings form a critical mass of evidence indicating that President Kennedy’s autopsy was falsified, and help establish a compelling case that people within the federal government covered up evidence of frontal shots – and hence of multiple gunmen and conspiracy in the assassination of President Kennedy.

Because it pulls this evidence together in one place, Murder in Dealey Plaza is one of the most important books to date on the Kennedy assassination.

The new evidence turns the tables. No longer can defenders of the lone assassin theory hide behind the autopsy evidence and claim that it trumps all the other evidence.

The weight of this other evidence now trumps the autopsy report. Lone assassin theorists must address and explain the new evidence if they wish to regain credibility.

It is time for people of integrity who were involved in the official investigations  especially the professionals – to take a good-faith look at the new evidence and confront the likelihood that their conclusions were based on falsified data .

Murder in Dealey Plaza may not be the last word on the medical evidence, but it should be the starting point for a fresh look – not only at the medical evidence, but also at the assassination and its implications.

three

Lee said it was his face imposed on someone else's body--and he was right!

Those implications, I might add, are substantial in their impact upon alternative theories of the assassination.

The mafia, for example, would not have been able to extend its reach into Bethesda Naval Hospital to alter X-rays under the control of medical officers of the US Navy, agents of the Secret Service, and the president’s personal physician.

Neither pro nor anti-Castro Cuban could have substituted another brain for that of JFK. Even if the KGB had an ability to alter films comparable to that of the CIA and Hollywood, it could not have obtained the original of the Zapruder.

These findings thus indicate that at least some of those involved had to have been among the nation’s highest officials, a result that receives further support from James Douglass, JFK and the Unspeakable (2008) and Phillip Nelson, LBJ: Mastermind of JFK’s Assassination (2010).

It is long past time that the American people are entitled to know the truth about the death of our 35th president.


Jim Fetzer, a former Marine Corps officer who earned his Ph.D. in the history and the philosophy of science, is McKnight Professor Emeritus at the Duluth campus of the University of Minnesota. He co-edits assassinationresearch.com with John Costella.


 

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97 Comments for “JFK: What We Know Now that We didn’t Know Then”

  1. I liked your last article, Was George H.W. Bush Involved in Assassination of JFK?

    We both know who runs the shadow government, your article pointed somewhat in this direction, however, go back about twenty years or so…and the start of a large corporation.

  2. Those are all excellent quotes. If you only knew as much as you think you know, Trowbridge! Do you ever do any actual research on subjects like these before you blow your horn? Have you ever heard of a guy named “Jack Ruby”, for example? Do you think he was just “blowing smoke”, too? Never mind. No one cares what you think.

    Jack Ruby (Oswald’s assassin) makes a statement to reporters after he has been permitted a new trial. He says:

    Everything pertaining to what’s happening has never come to the surface. The world will never know the true facts, of what occurred, my motives. The people had , that had so much to gain and had such an ulterior motive for putting me in the position I’m in, will never let the true facts come above board to the world.

    Reporter : Are these people in very high positions Jack ??

    Jack : Yes.

    Other quotes of Jack Ruby that are on film:

    “Gentlemen, I want to tell the truth, but I cannot tell it here. If you want a fair shake out of me, you have to take me to Washington”

    “When I mentioned about Adlai Stevenson, if he was vice president there would never have been an assassination of our beloved President Kennedy ” Asked if he would explain it again Ruby continued “Well the answer is the man in office now” – that man was Lyndon Johnson.

    Ruby fearing for his life, and the life of his family told the Warren commission….”Well, you won’t see me again. I tell you that a whole new form of government is going to take over the country, and I know I won’t live to see you another time”

    It reads: “you must believe me that I know what is taking place, so please with all my heart, you must believe me, because I am counting on you to save this country a lot of blood-shed. As soon as you get out you must read Texan looks at Lyndon (A Texan Looks at Lyndon by J. Evetts Haley) , and it may open your eyes to a lot of things. This man is a Nazi in the worst order.”

    Further on in this letter Ruby writes: … isn’t it strange that Oswald who hasn’t worked a lick most of his life, should be fortunate enough to get a job at the Book Building two weeks before the president himself didn’t know as to when he was to visit Dallas, now where would a jerk like Oswald get the information that the president was coming to Dallas? Only one person could have had that information, and that man was Johnson who knew weeks in advance as to what was going to happen, because he is the one who was going to arrange the trip for the president, this had been planned long before the president himself knew about, so you can figure that one out. The only one who gained by the shooting of the president was Johnson, and he was in a car in the rear and safe when the shooting took place. What would the Russians, Castro or anyone else have to gain by eliminating the president? If Johnson was so heartbroken over Kennedy, why didn’t he do something for Robert Kennedy? All he did was snub him.

    I have been used for a purpose, and there will be a certain tragic occurrence happening if you don’t take my testimony and somehow vindicate me so my people don’t suffer because of what I have done.
    Jack Ruby

    • Gee Jim, I actually agree with your Ruby post, but since you claim that “Every post you make is displaying further and further deterioration of your ability to reason” then i guess you must be wrong because how could i possibly agree with you when my reasoning is so faulty to begin with? we all know that you are never wrong about anything so under your logic if i agree with you about Ruby then i must be right because you are always right so i guess my reasoning skills aren’t so bad. As far as Phil Nelson i have no criticism of him at all, he sounded reasonable in your previous interviews with him (i listened to the previous interviews so stop lying by saying i didn’t) I doubt i will read Nelson’s book because we all know LBJ was involved so i certainly don’t need further confirmation of that.

      • Good one, Shane! When your’re right, your’re right–and in this case, you are right! Nice catch. My oversight. My compliments. Thanks.

  3. I completely agree with you, Derek Shane, about the totally unreliable character of Phil Nelson’s trashing to LBJ, and not needing to even read it, once Fetzer himself provided the most glowing review of it on Amazon, and Charles Drago, a close acquaintance of his, responded just a couple of months ago about it being
    “disinformation of the most disgusting order, SHAME on Nelson, Fetzer, and the rest of the cover-up enablers.”

    Fetzer based his review upon what Ms. Brown forced out of LBJ by asking if he was involved in killing JFK just after the assassination and told Noel Twyman at Dallas Hyatt Regency Tower on November 24, 1996 – what Fetzer claimed took place on New Year’s Eve 1964 in LBJ’s suite at the Driskill Hotel.

    Fetzer did this to make it appear that she had said this many times before when the question Twyman asked
    just after the assassination showed that this was the first time she challenged him. (p. 850) It also got her describing the other crimes that Billie Sol Estes had allegedly committed for him.

    It’s a classic case of the prosecutor piling up false stories to convict, as least in the eyes of the public, the accused as charged.

    Actually, if one wants to write a book about Vice President Johnson mastermining the assassination of the President, he would have a better case against Vice President Andrew Johnson somehow escaping death and exposure about the assassination of President Lincoln by John Wilkes Booth.

    While Booth killed Lincoln, the planned assassin, George Atzerodt, of Vice President Johnson never did it, apparently because he got cold feet but just maybe it was just a ruse for an alibi. Booth had even dropped by earlier at the KIrkwood Hotel, and left a card – apparently to see if Johnson was still alive, or a home.

    While Booth was killed during his capture, Atzerodt was arrested, and executed for aiding and abetting the assassination, and then President Johnson was in no mood to commute his execution.

    Now that’s a real case of Vice President Johnson mastermining the President’s assassination?

    • Neither of them has read the book or listened to our interviews. They possess knowledge without evidence. They are complete and total nitwits who richly deserve each other! I am at a loss as to what to do with them. Their pile of rubbish is getting higher and deeper. They don’t even understand the criticism they parrot. The book is a masterpiece, which reminds me of a saying about pearls. They are — or could be or should be — the founding members of the new group, “Lunatics ‘R Us”!

  4. I have no brief for LBJ, as I wrote him a letter, in January 1965 as I recall, after he upped the civil war in Vietnam by going along with the Tonkin Gulf ploy that Alexander Haig aka ‘Deep Thoat’ later et al. put together to go after the communists in Asia instead of in Cuba because of the Connally cockup.

    In the letter, I said that I was outraged by his turnaround, and vowed to do what I could to see that he was not re-elected – what proved to be true, but I got myself on the government’s list of potential terrorists by doing so – what Jonathan Vankin didn’t believe when he interviewed me when I was working for the Ridgefield Press in 1989 for an article in the Worcester weekly about my theory about the Dallas assassination, and why it helped get me to leave teaching at Holy Cross.

    Vankin was amazed to learn that my suspicions proved to be true when he got the results of a FOIA request he had put in shortly before I left the States permanently that fall.

    Certainly LBJ was a most crooked politician but no more so than JFK since Joe got Giancana, Mayor Daley et al. to secure of the electoral vote in Illinois in November 1960. No matter what troubles LBJ had with Congress, he would never have been removed from office by it, like Spiro Agnew was. As long as JFK kept him as Vice President, only the polls could removed him, and that was why it was so important for JFK to visit Texas. Without its votes, his chances of being re-elected looked doubtful.

    As for Cain et al. being involved in the killing, Chuck Giancana’s description of what happened to him ten years later in Rose’s Sandwich Shop is totally persuasive with me (p. 351-2), though he failed to appreciate the significance of the walkie-talkie man and the shotgun man with the white and black gloves looking for the man with “the package”, and when the shotgun man found Cain, he blew his head off.

    The gloves were a sign of the joint Mafia-CIA operation, and “the package” was a reference to the Mannlicker Carcano that Cain failed to test fire from the sixth floor of the TSBD, and shooting off his mouth too much about who really killed Kennedy..

    You can already imagine what I would write now.

  5. Oh, I did forget to explain why LBJ, though he strongly suspected that JFK would be assassinated in Dallas, was not involved in the conspiracy to kill him.

    If ever a person was between a rock and a hard place it was the Vice President when President and Mrs. Kennedy went to Texas on Nomvewr 21, 1963. LBJ clearly hated Jack, and would not have shed a tear if some unknown person or conspiracy had killed him.

    It was quite a diffferent matter when persons he knew, and worked with planned on killing the President, expecting that it would lead to international results they all wanted, and with the prospect that LBJ would not get himself elected in the 1964 election.

    So, LBJ was confronted with dilemmas almost unknown to man, certainly not modern day politics. If he gave an inkling about what he thought JFK really faced in Texas, he would have been dismissed as a wheeler-dealer who was just trying to panick the Kennedys by attempting to seek higher office – what JFK faced if he didn’t face up to his critics and potential opponents in Texas.

    So, LBJ played the threats on public officials, unlike what Nixon and Connally did, thinking that it would be a good guide for how the President should react to such threats. It would have been much more damaging to LBJ, when he too had been subjected to threats, if he had gone into Dealey Plaza without a worry in the world, and his SS protection nowhere to be seen.

    Unfortunately for JFK, he did not take the Nixon and Connally threats seriously, believing that Tricky Dick would never go to the extreme of seeing him dead after the defeats in the 1960 presidential election, and the 1962 gubernatorial election in California in 1962 – where Nixon tried to play the strongman in the Cuban Missile Crisis but without success – but Kennedy vastly underestimated what Nixon was capable of.

    • If anyone wants further proof that Trowbridge Ford has nothing to contribute to understanding the assassination of JFK, read Phillip Nelson’s LBJ: MASTERMIND OF JFK’S ASSASSINATION (2nd edition, 2011). I just finished interviewing him for a two-hour program to be broadcast over http://revereradio.net from 5-7 PM/CT today. It will be archived on http://radiofetzer.blogspot.com along with five other two-hour shows with leading experts on the assassination, including John Costella, Ph.D., the leading authority on the Zapruder film; Doug Horne, Chief Analyst for Military Records for the Assassination Records Review Board and author of the five-volume INSIDE THE ARRB (2009); David W. Mantik, M.D., Ph.D., the foremost expert on the medical evidence in the world today; Karyn Holt-Harcourt, whose father, Chauncey Marvin Holt, prepared fifteen sets of forged Secret Service credentials for use in and around Dealey Plaza: Len Osanic, the host of Black Op Radio, who was the long-time assistant to Fletch Prouty, who was represented by the figure, “Colonel X”, in Oliver Stone’s “JFK”; and Phil Nelson. I must say that I have never encountered anyone so woefully inept at dealing with issues like these as Trowbridge Ford.

      • The Mantik, Horne and Costella interviews were good but that Holt-Harcourt woman was so boring i didn’t even last 40 minutes, The Nelson interview should be good but your guy who uploads the audio to the archives is as slow as molasses, only problem with Nelson is that he titles his book as if LBJ was the man who masterminded the assassination – i have always believed that military people and other high ranking government officials along with officials from the corporations that comprise the military industrial complex went to LBJ first and then Johnson went along with the assassination. Greg Burnham has exposed how McGeorge Bundy was involved as he was busy drafting NSAM 273 on November 21st 1963 – a memorandum he surely knew JFK would never sign but LBJ most definitely would.

        • That’s very impressive: to draw conclusions about Phil Nelson’s book without reading it and my interview with him without listening to it! Great work, Derek Shane! You impress me more and more with every post.

          • your right Jim, i have not read his book yet although i have listened to your previous interviews with him, my comment was only in reference to the title of his book which i think is not true. but of course you now regard me as your enemy so you attack me for no reason except for vengeance. i am not your enemy – your enemy is yourself because you write articles that are impossible to prove, take your GHW Bush piece – a researcher like DiEugenio would never write an article like that because he knows he can’t prove that it’s true, you take your own hypothesis and turn it into what you describe as facts but which the rest of us regard as fiction.

          • You are projecting. I don’t consider you to be “my enemy”. Frankly, I don’t care what you think, because your reasoning skills are so impoverished. That you continue with this flaying out in every direction suggests that you have serious problems that deserve professional attention. Every post you make is displaying further and further deterioration of your ability to reason. Rejecting Phil Nelson’s research on the basis of the title of his book, for example, demonstrates your intellectual incompetence in spades.

  6. While you don’t answer my queries, I shall answer yours since you sound like a reasonable person for a change.

    My source for Cain , Nicolletti and Milwaukee Phil Alderisio being the main assassins is based upon what Chuch Giancana said about his brother Momo in Double Cross: The Explosive, Inside Story of the Mobster Who Controlled America (pp. 334-5). Chuch had little to gain by claining so. So, I believe it is the truth, provided that one understands that this was all done behind Momo’s back, and he was to be made the fallguy for the assassination if this proved necessary, so he spoke with an authority which was not justified, especially about Agency officials being on the site to direct the assassination.

    For Cain’s comeuppance for failing to test fire the rifle which almost killed Connally when he fired it, and talking too grandly about killing the President, see pp. 350-1.

    It also raises questions again of where the bullets came from – what Fetzer has completely fuzzed up by claiming that none of the bullets which hit Connallly and JFK came from the TSBD.

    What about the bullets, then, which missed – e.g, the bullet found in the grass 300 feet from the TSBD, the one which hit just in front of the President’s limosine, the bullet hitting its wndshield, the piece of one which hit James T. Teague on the cheek, and the one which dented the chrome trim on the windshield of the limosine

    They are all parts of the coordinated fire which we still know much too little about, thanks to Fetzer’s limited wild goose chase.

    • On the contrary, it is my position that as many as three shots were fired from the west side of the Texas School Book Depository at Gov. John Connally, no doubt in the false belief that it was Sen. Ralph Yarborough, whom Lyndon sought to get into the limo with JFK, where Jack overruled him on the ground that the chief executive of the state should ride with the chief executive of the United States. When someone like Trowbridge cannot get something this simple right, you know that, when it comes to matters more complex, you are dealing with a person who has a diminished capacity for getting anything right! I am sorry to say it, but his eagerness to make a fool of himself is something to behold!

  7. You people can make fun of me, and belittle my efforts as much as you like, but none of you have a record like mine, like this letter to President Clinton which got him involved in getting his Chief of Staff Leon Panetta, and the soon to be DCI George Tenet to attempt to see me killed on several occasions in Portugal:

    35 Rua Romania
    Boa Vista, Serra do Bouro
    2500 Caldas da Rainha
    Portugal
    April 30, 1994
    The Honorable William J. Clinton
    President, The United States of America
    The White House
    Washington, D. C.
    U.S.A.

    Dear President Clinton,

    I have postponed writing you for a week in the vain hope that events would ultimately prove one unnecessary, but they have just compounded my anger and dismay. I am referring to the support the United States provided, and the testaments you gave to fomrer President Richard M. Nixon upon his death. Mr. Nixon was undoubtedly one of the worst Presidents the country ever had, and it is simply disgusting for you to try to make out that he was one of the best. That is just what Howard Hunt’s Plumbers’ Unit and all the prople who tried to cover up the Watergate break-in wanted from you. It is a slap in the face to all the people who worked so hard and with such difficulty to establish was a felon Nixon was, and to see that he was removed from office.

    I do not say this an an original Nixon hater, but as one who after years of serious study had concluded that Tricky Dick was even worse then we thought. Rather than be taken in by his adoption of the Charles Colson gambit to achieve his rehabilitation, we should be looking into the real causes of Watergate, and why did Nixon do so many felonious acts to try to cover it up, what President Ford, despite his promises to the contrary, pardoned. “The Bay of Pigs thing” that Nixon was willing to pay a million dollars in hush money to Howard Hunt was a referrence to the assassination of President John F. Kennedy, what people like Hunt, Richard Helms of the CIA, J. Edgar Hoover of the FBI, Alexander Haig of the DOD, politicians Nixon and John Connally had organized with various Mafia hitmen to rectify the original invasion. It was only because of Connally’s wounding that the plan to blame Castro for the President’s assassination did not go ahead, leading to a most ad hoc solution to the crime. Without Connally’s wounding, we would have had a resumption of the Cuban Missile Crisis, resulting quite probably in a nuclear war with the Soviet Union.

    In sum, rather than spend good taxpayer money to try to polish up this most terrible President, you should have the Attorney General look into his earlier crimes, or appoint a new commission to determine what really happened to JFK and the country in Dallas. If you want further massive evidence on these matters, I would be happy to oblige. Kennedy’s unsolved murder calls for no less.

    Sincerely yours,

    Trowbridge H. Ford, Ph.D.
    —————————-

    Of course, I never heard a word from the White House, not even an acknowledgement of its reception.

  8. Well, if Ms. Brown had always been saying that LBJ made the comments before the assassinatio, why would Twyman start raising the matter on this note of November 24, 1996:

    Twyman: “Now when Lyndon had this outbrust, after the assassination. when you challenged him, tell me about that.” (Quoted from p. 850)

    Twyman obviously had not heard about any outburst before the assassination, so who did he get it from? From you, his mentor?

    • That’s because of your massive ignorance about the case. Madeleine was well-known in Dallas and her story has been consistent from the beginning. Only someone who doesn’t know that these exchanges occurred on two different occasions would confound them, where you love to impugn my integrity when you are displaying you own deranged state of mind. You really need to get a grip on yourself.

      The exchange on pages 850-851 was at the Driskill Hotel in Austin on New Year’s Eve. The caption came from what Lyndon said to her at the home of Clint Murchison the night before the assassination. I think it is long past time that you ceased making an idiot of yourself, Trowbridge. We all admire your brilliance and realize that none of us could ever possibly hope to equal your accomplishments.

  9. In looking more closely at everything in Twyman’s book, the claim about LBJ telling Ms. Brown the night before the assassination that the “blankety blank’ Kennedys would never embrass him again’, ” is in the book, though she told him in the November 24, 1996 interview no such thing. See Bloody Treason, pp. 850-51.

    Still in framing LBJ in the first photo of the book, it shows the Vice President, Connally and Senator Ralph Yarborough standing behind JFK while he addressed a crowd in Fort Worth before the assassination.

    “On the left is Lyndon Johnson,” the cutline read, “who would become president in a few hours. According to Johnson’s mistress, Madeleine Brown, the vice president told her on the night before that assassination that after tomorrow, the ‘blankety-blank Kennedys would never embarrass him agaIn’.” (p. 13)

    This is gutter reporting of the worst sort, and it is interesting to note that just earlier in the short Acknowledgments, Twyman wrote: “Professor Fetzer provided me with much encouragement in my research.” (p. xii)

    Fetzer, did you encourage Twyman to put these words in the source’s mouth?

    • It has been obvious from the beginning that you had never read BLOODY TREASON. And since the caption of the photograph you cite from page 13 contradicts your assertion that Noel Twyman does not report her saying “any such thing”, we have another stunning proof of your incompetence. Madeleine has said the same thing since she began speaking out about her concerns regarding Lyndon’s complicity in the assassination, where Billy Sol Estes has corroborated LBJ’s involvement. As a professional scholar, I am committed to the truth, including about the assassination of JFK, where you appear willing to make reckless allegations, no matter how contradictory the evidence. You are the one who likes to make up evidence, not me. The guy in the gutter is Trowbridge Ford.

  10. You contend, Fetzer, that I have done nothing about the JFK assassination since 1978, and when I post a refutation of that, and an article to prove it, you ignore my post, and cut my article down to suit your whims, concluding that I stop.

    I shall only stop when you stop spreading your lies, red-herrings and false claims about the tragedy which have stopped enhancing our knowledge of the conspiracy assassination long ago..

    Here is more on a second stringer of the plot, Porter Goss:

    —– Original Message —–
    From: Trowbridge Ford
    To: ed@cc.uk.com
    Sent: Wednesday, September 15, 2004 10:04 AM
    Subject: porter goss nomination

    Secrets of the Florida Straits
    by
    Trowbridge H. Ford

    Since the Bush administration has decided to seek confirmation of Porter Goss, the retiring Republican Congressman from Florida’s 14th Congressional District, as the next Director of Central Intelligence, the public should be made aware of his most damaging secrets, especially since the White House has pursued a most cynical course in gaining approval of his nomination.

    One of the conventions of Congress is to approve the nomination of any of its members to a post requiring senatorial approval unless the candidate is notoriously corrupt, obviously unqualified or intensely disliked. It is to take advantage of this convention that the Goss nomination is being pursued since he had declined to run again in his district, and it is too late now to get on the Florida ballot. By waiting until the formation of the next Congress, Goss will then no longer be in a position to take advantage of the convention – what would promise a much more controversial confirmation process, especially if Bush retains the White House, no matter which political party controls the Senate after the November election. Goss is just too political in every aspect to succeed under these circumstances.

    So the Bush administration, confident that it will be returned in two months, is going ahead with the nomination to take advantage of the current, special conditions, believing full well that, if confirmed now, Goss will continue as DCI next year. The gutless Senate Democrats are relying upon the electorate to do their work for them, and will only regret their failure to act, come January.

    Given the qualifications, experience, and performance of all previous DCIs, it is hard to see how Goss how can be stopped on these normal grounds. He is certainly well enough educated, has had a wide variety of experience, and has not performed politically, especially as Chairman of the House Select Committee on Intelligence, in an overly partisan way too often. As a Congressman, an elected representative, he is expected to have policies, interests, and agendas that other politicians might neither approve of nor follow – what he has reminded the Senators of during the first day of hearings.

    This leaves Goss’s own experience as a CIA agent, starting right after he graduated from Yale, and the country was trying to recover from the ill-fated Bay of Pigs operation. In this context, it is most alarming for Goss, fluent in French and Spanish, and first serving the Agency in Miami, Haiti, and the Dominican Republic, to have stated that he then …”had some very interesting moments in the Florida Straits.” During that time, after the forced resignations of DCI Allen Dulles and DDP Richard Bissell because of the fiasco, the Agency was insubordinate, bordering on treachery, of Kennedy administration orders, especially in operations involving the Florida Straits. Never was the CIA so out of control from constituted authority.

    For example, when Attorney General Robert Kennedy was finally briefed on the Agency’s efforts with the Mafia to assassinate Cuba’s Fidel Castro – what MI5′s Peter Wright had finally persuaded the CIA to initiate in 1959, and William King Harvey was trying to effect under codename ZR/RIFLE, part of the Cuban Task Force W for Operation Mongoose, working out of the Miami station – he was furious to learn from Lawrence Houston that the Agency was using Mafia hitmen because it threatened to ruin all his efforts to prosecute them. While Kennedy thought that the collaboration had finished, and had made clear that he would be informed before it was attempted again, Harvey, the new DDP Richard Helms, and Johnny Roselli, a lieutenant of Chicago Mafioso Sam ‘Momo’ Giancana – thanks again to Wright’s encouragement in November 1961 (Peter Wright, Spycatcher, pp. 143-62) – were at it again.

    “Phase two,” Jonathan Vankin and John Whalen wrote in The 60 Greatest Conspiracies, “featured more poison pills, rifles, and explosives over the course of eleven more months – but all these plots failed as well….Neither Harvey nor Helms had informed CIA director McCone of Mafia phase two.” (p. 17) And he, of course, had neither informed the President nor the Attorney General who only learned of Harvey’s treachery when his commandos attacked Cuba during the tensest moments of the Cuban Missile Crisis, almost derailing diplomatic attempts to settle it peacefully.

    While the Kennedys did everything they could to stop Harvey and his Cuban exiles, ultimately forcing his transfer to Rome, Harvey went ahead with his own plans against Cuba as if Washington didn’t exist. In April 1963, Harvey was seen at Plantation Key, planning with his former subordinates, especially E. Howard Hunt, and William ‘Rip’ Robertson, new attacks on the island, again with the help of the Mafia’s Roselli, John Martino, Eddie Perez aka “Bayo”, and others, notably William Pawley. Pawley was closely connected to former Vice President Richard M. Nixon, and Life magazine’s Henry Luce.

    In June, the Martino mission took a Cuban assassination team in Pawley’s boat, close along the Cuban coastline, dropping them off to make the hit, and hoping to make contact with two Soviet colonels, willing to claim that Moscow had not returned to the USSR all its missiles, as dictated by the terms of the settlement. But instead of the colonels being turned over to the government, as Peter Dale Scott has written in Deep Politics and the Death of JFK, they would give a press conference to prove that the Soviets were again threatening America, and that the Kennedy administration was doing nothing about it. ((pp. 115-6)

    When these plans didn’t work out, a CIA agent sneaked into Havana in September to reactivate Rolando Cubela aka AM/LASH to make another hit on Castro. To get Cubela on board, Demond Fitzgerald, Harvey’s successor at Miami, claimed that he was the Attorney General’s representative, and that Fizgerald was no mere operative but a real US Senator. While the Agency later disputed this audacity, claiming that Cubela initiated the operation, he convincingly denied the claims when Anthony Summers interviewed him while researching The Kennedy Conspiracy. (See, esp., pp. 322-4.)

    Harvey et al. then decided to make AM/LASH a convenient fallguy for Castro’s apparent effort to kill JFK himself while making Jack Ruby actually set up the real one. (For more on this, see my article about Harvey in the Archive.) What’s really interesting is that their efforts in Miami opened the door for the actual assassination in Dallas – JFK was so threatened and protected in the Sunshire State that he promised to many, especially actress Joan Crawford, Nixon’s employer at Pepsi-Cola, that he would take as many risks as possible when he visited Texas a few days later. Little wonder that Martino told his wife Florence this when he heard about the trip: “Flo, they’re going to kill him. They’re going to kill him when he gets to Dallas.” (Quoted from Noel Twyman, Bloody Treason, p. 631.)

    When JFK was setting out on the Texas trip, the most treacherous act of all by the CIA, and the least investigated occurred – the apparent shooting down by Castro of a U-2 reconnaissance plane, piloted by Captain Joe Glenn Hyde, Jr. The LaGrange (Ga.) Daily News, Hyde’s home town, was filled with
    ominous stories about the crash while reminding readers that similar flights had first discovered Soviet MRBMs in Cuba in October 1962, and that flights were continuing to make sure that they had left.

    His mother, for example, said that he had called her on the 19th, to wish her a happy birthday from some undisclosed place, but now he had simply disappeared in the “Ten Fathom Curve” area, 40 miles northwest of Key West. While the Strategic Air Command (SAC) did not believe that Hyde had been shot down by the Cubans, it did note that the plane crashed without transmitting any radio messages, and that the downing of Major Rudolf Anderson’s U-2 plane during the Missile Crisis took the world to the brink of nuclear war.

    The day of the assassination, the Navy and Coast were conducting an all-out search to find Hyde who had apparently ejected from the aircraft before it crashed, and to recover the U-2. If Hyde had done so, it might take days to find him. “Strict security measures are in effect in the salvage area and newsmen are not permitted near the scene,” the lead story of the Georgia daily reported. While neither mechanical trouble, nor Cuban fire had been ruled out as the cause of the accident, the stories clearly indicated that only Hyde, if he were recovered, could convincingly establish what had happened.

    After JFK was assassinated, and attempts by the CIA, the Bureau, and the Defense Department to blame it upon Castro and the Soviets had been quashed, all interest in Hyde’s condition and whereabouts simply died. The LaGrange Daily News settled for the shortest story on the inside the next day, entitled “Searchers Find No Trace of Glenn Hyde”, and other papers across the country hardly had more. The mystery was not clarified either six month later when Hyde’s survivors received his Distinguished Flying Cross for a flight he made in January 1963, a Fifth Oak Lead Cluster to the Air Medal for flights which did not include his apparently fatal one, and there was no mention of any Purple Heart for his apparent demise.

    In sum, this appears to be the dirtest kind of covert action possible – what could easily have led to the resumption of the Missile Crisis if matters had gone according to plan in Dallas – and it is impossible to believe that Goss did not have it in mind when he referred to “interesting moments in the Florida Straits.”
    He should be grilled at least about what was going on, and what really happened to Hyde. Is he living, for example, somewhere else under an assumed name?

    For Senators disinclined to raise such explosive questions about old operations, I would remind them that this might well constitute treason – what one would hardly expect of a DCI officially committed to following constituted authority, especially when it is seeking a mandate to carry out all kinds of preemptive attacks, especially on Castro’s Cuba, and his cohort in Venezuela, Hugo Chavez. Come January, if Goss is confirmed, he could carry out legally what he attempted treacherously behind the back of the Kennedy administration.

  11. And here is an article I wrote when Porter Goss, of all people, was chosen to replace 9/11 cockup artist George Tenet as DCI when looking for the first article in my history of the National Reconnassiance Office: http://codshit.blogspot.com/2004/09/is-porter-goss-right-man-for-cia.html

    Is Porter Goss the Right Man for the CIA?

    by Trowbridge Ford

    . . .

    What is really alarming about Goss’s experience with the Agency is when he says this: “I had some very interesting moments in the Florida Straits.” Of course, the straits are between the Florida keys and Castro’s Cuba. Now this is the area where the CIA sent Mafia-connected agents across to kill the Cuban leader by poisons, rifles, and explosives in the 11 months leading up to the Cuban Missile Crisis despite the prohibition of Attorney General Robert Kennedy. They went on to send in commando teams during the Crisis jeopardizing international negotiations for settling it despite orders from the White House.

    During the President’s assassination, they were trying again to assassinate Castro, to exfiltrate a Red Army Colonel from Cuba who would claim that Moscow had gone back on the terms of the Missile Crisis settlement, and to make it look as if the Cuban dictator had shot down Captain Glenn Hyde’s U-2 flight over the straits at the time to confirm it. As a member of the House Assassinations Committee staff said: “Harvey may have been the key in accomplishing the assassination” (Quoted from Anthony Summers, The Kennedy Conspiracy, p. 529), and Goss was working for Harvey.

    America, in short, has enough on its plate right now without recalling the Dallas experience in a most charged confirmation hearing. Let the current leadership run the Agency until after the election, and then let the new President decide what to do about the CIA and its DCI.

    :

  12. Rigfht Fetzer, I am fixed on the theory that I stated for the HSCA after Representative Henry Gonzalez of Austin asked me to do so, and what was forgotten about when Richard Sprague, the prosecutor, stated that he was going to use lie-detectors in his investigation – what got rid of him, and my lines of inquiry.

    Mickey Goldsmith even called me up before it issued its report about the JFK one, stating falsely that my claims had been investigated when there was no sign of them anywhere – not even the three articles that Tom Valentine published in The National Exchange in its bibliography, though it had ones about space-aliens having done it!

    I could mouth what you state about the medical evidence but it does nothing convincingly to tell us where the shooters, even on the sixth floor of the TSBD where Cain and Nicoletti were stationed, were without question, much less how many shots were fired.

    Your minute inquiries lead nowhere – what seems to be your intent.

    Since 1978, I have learned much more about Peter Wright’s instigation of Harvey et al. to go after JFK no matter what Robert Kennedy ordered, thanks to the publication of Spy Catcher in 1987, NSA Director Gordon Blake’s role in the ruse to make it look like Castro had gone back on the settlement of the Cuban Missile Crisis by retaining IRBMs which Captain Joe Glenn Hyde’s U-2 had discovered when he apparently was shot down over the island, Porter Goss being in the Florida Straits to pick up the pieces at Castro’s expense on November 21st, and to cover it up when the Connally fiasco ruined the plot, have done a six-part history of the National Reconnaissance Office which arranged the bogus flight and cover up, and have been the murder target of the CIA and Clinton’s White House when I kept complaining about its cozying up to principal players in the conspiracy, mainly Nixon, Helms, and Haig.

    Shall post the articles about the attempts to kill me because of my JFK research after I do one about the NSA Director – the missing guy in the whole plot who kept JFK’s nose to the grindstone during the Cuban Missile Crisis but was seemingly caught completely by surprise when the poor President was killed in Dallas by the Dirty Dozen.

    Now must leave to go back to the Blake article.

    • Indeed. It might help lesser mortals however if he would deign to explain the evidence that led him to this ironclad conclusion.

      • Well, “ironclad” may not be the right term, since we are talking about likelihoods and probabilities. On the principle of inference to the best explanation, try “Thinking about ‘Conspiracy Theories’: 9/11 and JFK”, which you can access on-line. My most recent JFK presentation that is already on-line is “What happened to JFK–and why it matters today”, http://jamesfetzer.blogspot.com/2009/12/httpdotsub.html Check ‘em out and we can discuss these issues in greater detail, if you like.

  13. When you acknowledged you were ignorant of the medical evidence, which implied you could not possibly know the trajectories of the shots or the locations from which they were fired, you told us all that we needed to know to recognize that you are incompetent to be addressing these serious questions and, it now appears, are fixated on something that you published in 1978! I am sorry, Trowbridge, but you have demonstrated that you are unqualified to comment on the assassination of JFK with any assurance beyond speculation, hearsay and rumor. We get it!

    • Looks like Trowbridge has really ripped you apart Jim, much like i did a few weeks ago on your absurd claims at the Ambassador, you are a bellicose bully who loves to berate anyone with opposing points of view. I listened to your Salbuchi interview and before it even started you reiterated that preposterous Saddam story that has so many holes in it you could drive building 7 through it. I know you are retired and have nothing better to do but maybe you should get a new hobby.

      • This is bizarre, Derek. I suggest that you and Trowbridge get together to share your fantasies. Like you, he has done nothing to show I am wrong on any point–and if you think that his two shooters can account for shots fired from six locations, you must be as much in need of cognitive assistance as is he. When you have nothing of value to post, I don’t understand why you do. You both seem to have a primal need to attack those who actually know what they are talking about.

        Why don’t you spell out what you think I have wrong and Trowbridge has right and how you know, because I am not alone in regarding him as having nothing of value to contribute to the investigation of the death of JFK–and you are now standing with him, through thick and through thin, as they say. So why is he right and I’m wrong? Do tell us. You have a lot of material to work with, since I must make 20 or more points about the assassination in this article alone. Have at it!

        • After reading Trowbridge’s comments i guess i only agree that the mob was involved but i have only ever believed that because of what Ruby did, the Files story is certainly false, Nicolletti was killed right after he was called to testify to the HSCA so he must have known something, just like Gianacana and Roselli must have known so they were murdered too. I actually believe someone shot from the TSBD using the mauser that deputy Craig saw but the shooter fired from the opposite window, i definitely believe shots were fired from the Daltex building and possibly the records building, and of course from the fence behind the knoll, the Zapruder film has been altered (give you credit for that Jim) as far as Madeline Brown the problem with her story is that we have to take her word for it – she could have been looking for her 15 minutes of fame – not saying she’s lying but where is the supporting evidence? as far as LBJ – of course he was involved, you might be interested that Jim Marrs talked to a person on the plane at LBJ’s swearing in and this man told Marrs that LBJ actually had the oath of office in his coat pocket after judge Sarah Hughes told everyone she was sorry for being late but she had trouble finding the swearing in ceremony at which time LBJ promptly pulled it out of his jacket – how convenient for Lyndon!, if anyone looks closely at the Altgens photo you can see lady bird and Yarborough but not LBJ – guess he knew to duck down or maybe he was just tying his shoes.we basically know what happened in Dealey Plaza – we just aren’t sure about all the details.as far as Barr McLellan i read his book and found it interesting but he used that faction method which lessens the credibility of his book – Walt Brown said the original manuscript was far better. there’s a video on youtube where the most important Dealey witness Lee Bowers actually told friends that he saw 2 shooters:

          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vNivLlyMneU

        • I only agree that the mob was involved but i only believed that because of what Ruby did, the Files story is certainly false, Nicolletti was killed right after he was called to testify to the HSCA so he must have known something, just like Gianacana and Roselli must have known so they were murdered too. I actually believe someone shot from the TSBD using the mauser that deputy Craig saw but the shooter fired from the opposite window, i definitely believe shots were fired from the Daltex building and possibly the records building, and of course from the fence behind the knoll, the Zapruder film has been altered (give you credit for that Jim) as far as Madeline Brown the problem with her story is that we have to take her word for it – she could have been looking for her 15 minutes of fame – not saying she’s lying but where is the supporting evidence? as far as LBJ – of course he was involved, you might be interested that Jim Marrs talked to a person on the plane at LBJ’s swearing in and this man told Marrs that LBJ actually had the oath of office in his coat pocket after judge Sarah Hughes told everyone she was sorry for being late but she had trouble finding the swearing in ceremony at which time LBJ promptly pulled it out of his jacket – how convenient for Lyndon!, if anyone looks closely at the Altgens photo you can see lady bird and Yarborough but not LBJ – guess he knew to duck down or maybe he was just tying his shoes.we basically know what happened in Dealey Plaza – we just aren’t sure about all the details.as far as Barr McLellan i read his book and found it interesting but he used that faction method which lessens the credibility of his book – Walt Brown said the original manuscript was far better. there’s a video on youtube where the most important Dealey witness Lee Bowers actually told friends that he saw 2 shooters:

          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vNivLlyMneU

      • On the matter of MDB’s claims Jim is quite correct, as he is on the other accounts of LBJ’s involvement, which is not in itself implausible – he was a ruthless operator. There are some differences betwen them, so it’s not certain what his exact role was, and he would surely have let others do most of the dirty work, but he has certainly been implicated by several sources with inside access.

        On the other hand there is equally substantial testimony of Nicoletti’s involvement along with other mobsters. The two are not mutually exclusive.

        Trowbridge makes some interesting claims but the question is where is the evidence? Jim has actually worked to provide it, and contributed to some key advances on this.

  14. I don’t have a jock, but if I did, I certainly wouldn’t be hanging it up over this.

    For the current evidence about Fetzer’s reliability, notice this difference between the testimony about LBJ and the JFK assassination:

    Twyman’s version
    Ms. Brown told him that LBJ told her after the assassination that
    he didn’t do it – the oil men and the intelligence services did it.

    Fetzer’s version
    Ms. Brown told him dozens of times that LBJ told her before the
    killing that the Kenndys wouldn’t be kicking him around anymore.

    As for Fred Burks’ ability to persuade anyone of anything, remember he testified on the behalf of Abu Bakar Ba’asyir, the mass murderer in Indonesia.

    Seems like it’s time for you to hang up yours, Fetzer.

    • I am becoming convinced that Trowbridge Ford needs forms of assistance that go far beyond anything I can provide. He needs help! Madeleine made it unmistakable clear that LBJ admitted that he had been involved when she confronted him about it at the Driskill Hotel on New Years Eve, six weeks after the assassination. Trowbridge has cited BLOODY TREASON, but he has not read it or else has not understood what he has read. On page 285, for example, in refuting the familiar claim (which has been advanced by Jack Valenti, among others) that there cannot have been a conspiracy because “somebody would have talked and no one has”, he cites nine prominent figures who talked about the assassination before and after its occurrence.

      These include Carlos Marcello, Santo Trafficante, Jr, Joseph Milteer, Johnny Roselli, David Atlee Phillips, Lyndon Johnson, Marita Lorenz, Frank Sturgis, and Sam Giancanna. Others who have acknowledged participating in the crime include Chauncey Marvin Holt, Charles Harrelson, Jim Hicks, Jack Ruby, and Billy Sol Estes. The theme of BLOODY TREASON, for example, is that the conspiracy had to include collusion between the CIA/Military, Secret Service, Mafia and LBJ. He has tried to use it to rebut its own thesis, which is simply absurd. Trowbridge has the god-given right to make a fool of himself. But the extent to which he is accomplishing that goal is simply stunning. No one in possession of their rational faculties could do this so well.

  15. And while I’m at it, I might as well shoot down the claim that Fred Burks is pushing about Edward Clark, LBJ’s personal attorney. pushing the claim that the Vice President killed JFK.

    This is most understandable when LBJ told Ms. Brown that the oil peope and intelligence – “They did it.”

    Clark’s law firm apparently got a $2 million payoff from the oil people for arranging Chuckie Nicoletti and his backup Richard Cain doing the essentials of the assassination efforts.

    Of course, it wasn’t LBJ’s law firm, and Clark wasn’t working for him when Clark got Momo’s hitmen to do the job.

    Case against LBJ is now closed.

    • You are deluding yourself if you think you are “shooting down” anyone who has views contrary to your own. A better description would be that you are shooting yourself in the foot–BOTH FEET, again and again. Indeed, you might just as well be shooting yourself in the head, figuratively speaking, since you have no idea what you are taking about. Barr McClellan published BLOOD, MONEY & POWER about the involvement of Ed Clark and his law firm in planning aspects of the assassination. Billy Sol Estes, A TEXAS LEGEND, has confirmed that Lyndon sent Cliff Carter, his chief administrative assistant, to Dallas to make sure that all the arrangements were in place for the assassination.

      He (Billy Sol) became convinced from his own conversations with Cliff and Malcolm “Mac” Wallace, who was Lyndon’s personal hitman and killed a dozen persons for him, including one of his sisters, that they had been involved–and, indeed, as deeply as anyone apart from Lyndon himself could have been. If Fred Burks confirms what Barr McClellan has reported, that is further proof of LBJ’s involvement. I think you ought to hang up your jock on this, Trowbridge, because every post makes you look more and more out of touch with reality–not just about the assassination, where your ignorance is palpable, but about your own self-importance and knowledge of the case.

  16. Just more bobbing and weaving by the chief disinformation agent, Jim Fetzer, as if anything has changed about who killed JFK since November 22, 1963, and as if David Lifton added anything significant about who they really are.

    Regarding your lies about LBJ’s involvement, I just checked the interview of Madeleine Brown on November 24, 1996 in Noel Twyman’s Bloody Treason – the book you suggested that I consult about the matter – and the most relevant part goes like this:

    “Twyman: Now when Lyndon had this outburst, after the assassination, when you challenged him, tell me about that.

    M. Brown: Well everyone in Dallas – it was general gossip in the business group – that Lyndon was responsible. and having such warm feelings for him, I thought, ‘God, how could he be involved?’ I didn’t want to believe it. So I said, ‘Now Lyndon, you’ve got to tell me. You’ve got to talk to me. Are you – were you – involved with Kennedy’s death?’ And when I asked him that – anger – he would explode at the drop of a hat. He screamed and hollered, and I was really frightened because he had told me many years before that you don’t see, hear or repeat anything. And I thought I’ve really made a bad mistake. But finally he said, ‘You know the people that I know.’ talking about the oil people and intelligence. ‘They did it’.” (pp. 850-1)

    So much for your doubious claims that she told you 100 times that Lyndon it. Either she never did or she changed her story, making her a most unreliable witness.

    Why do you continue to want to railroad the wrong people for the assassination?

    • “Bobbing and weaving”? We are beyond the realm of absurdity. You have acknowledged that you do not know the medical evidence, which means that you cannot know the ballistics or the locations from which shots were fired, much less who fired them. While I had more than 100 conversations with Madeleine, not all of them involved Lyndon. We covered that many times, but something is wrong with you. JFK was hit (at least) four times: once in the throat (from in front); once in the back (from behind); and twice in the head (from behind and from the right front). Connally was hit from one to three times (from the side). So how many of these shots were fired by Richard Cain and Chuckie Nicoletti? How many places were they at the same time? You seem to have lost your mind.

      What David Lifton contributed was evidence that the body was stolen from Parkland, that it was transported to Washington, but that it had been removed from the ceremonial bronze casket and transported (apparently by helicopter) to Walter Reed for the removal of bullet fragments. It was then delivered to the morgue at Bethesda in a black hearse, while the official entourage, including the ceremonial casket in a grey ambulance, made its way to Bethsda. Jerrol Custer, the radiology technician who took the X-rays, was already headed upstairs to develop X-rays he had taken when he observed the grey ambulance carrying Jackie arrive at the front of the building, which he thought was very strange, since the body was already undergoing the official autopsy and could not have been with the entourage.

      What we have here is powerful proof of complicity in the crime at the highest levels of the military and the government. The alteration of the body, changes to the X-rays, and faking of films and photographs demonstrate that the cover-up had been planned in detail, where taking JFK to Bethesda was the ideal location, since, if the conspirators needed a substitute X-ray, they could not only produce one but, because JFK’s medical records as a former Naval officer were in its archives, they could produce a genuine JFK X-ray. Noel’s book, BLOODY TREASON, of course, makes a massive case for the involvement of LBJ; and, in her book, TEXAS IN THE MORNING, Madeleine reaffirms her belief that Lyndon was involved. You need to study them and Doug Horne’s INSIDE THE ARRB as well as Phil Nelson’s LBJ: MASTERMIND OF JFK’S ASSASSINATION, if you want to understand the case.

  17. Although Jim loves to ridicule anyone who disagrees with him i believe he is right about the Files story being a fraud – it simply isn’t believable that on the day of the murder they decided “hey lets go shoot the president” The very end of this video appears to show LHO and Lovelady moments after the assassination

    http://www.youtube.com/user/HelmerReenberg#p/a/C3508F37D1866E43/0/BL9u-ED6ftY

    • There is nothing that proves Files’ story beyond a doubt but your objection is off base – he claims they were prepping it for some time and details the alleged movements in the lead-up to the day. Have you even actually read or seen any of it? Because your claim is a joke.

      • When his “Confession” first appeared, I was asked to review it for a local television show. It was obvious he knew a lot about the assassination, but the very idea that he would casually be asked to be a shooter on the morning of the event was absurd. I am convinced he was not a shooter, but the weapon he describes is very interesting. A shot from the picket fence, by the way, is not the right location for the wound, which David Mantik and I believe was fired from an above-ground sewer opening half-way between the road and the top of the Triple Underpass. There does appear to have been a shot fired from the grassy knoll, which missed and was picked up from the grass on the opposite side of the limousine. But believe whatever you want. Thanks.

        • I didn’t say I believed it but it’s worth serious consideration and can’t just be dismissed off hand. Again he doesn’t claim to have “been casually asked”, he was a trusted pro on the team, who was up to the day involved in the preparation including zeroing the weapons, according to his account. Maybe they intended him to shoot all along but didn’t tell him til then (need to know), or maybe it was a last minute improv. At any rate I don’t find the objection raised to be cogent per se.

          I think he also claims another shooter was in the sewer, so that could account for what you say, although he claims to have fired the fatal head shot (or one of two).

          • But, Steve, we have accounted for all the wounds and locations of all the shooters. Surely you don’t think we haven’t gone over issues like this with a fine-toothed comb? I have just given a lecture on JFK at the University of Wisconsin-Madison last night, which will be made available on YouTube or other sites in the near term. So far as I can see, while the mob wanted Jack out and was complicit in the crime, where Jack Ruby’s involvement is the most conspicuous indication, I find James File’s “confession” implausible in comparison to the alternatives. I respect your right to believe File’s story, but there were shooters at six locations, where no two shooters could have been situated at the same time, whether on your account or on that of others. If he had really been there, don’t you think he would have shared that there were five other shooters besides himself in addition to describing the limo stop? Think about it. He wasn’t there.

          • Maybe he wasn’t there, as I said there’s no hard proof (not even the 222 casing). But he did claim 3-4 shooters in his team alone (CN,JR,himself and some other guy maybe) not just two, so again it’s not quite so slam dunk. Plus some other credible people backed parts of his story. And it’s not like he has really benefitted from his claims, all in all, it finished his prospects of release for one thing. But as you seem to have made up your mind there’s not much point arguing it.

          • Steve, On the contrary, you have already argued it. You have to be wary of changes in his story. He cannot have fired the shot that hit JFK in the right temple and not reported that the limo was brought to a halt to make it possible. As a former Marine Corps officer who supervised recruit and marksmanship training at the same depot (San Diego) and rifle range (Edson Range) where Lee Oswald took his own training, I well know that there is a huge different between firing at a stationary target as opposed to a moving one, which I am sure you will acknowledge. From that initial interview, I cannot recall anything about other shooters than himself and Chuckie Nicoletti, where Nicoletti asked him to back him up. Once the weaknesses in a story are known, it is child’s play to elaborate with “details” that you forgot to mention. It’s not that I am dismissing his story “out of hand”, as you have implied more than once, but that his account does not satisfy my standards for credibility. Add whatever you like. I’ve spent my professional career teaching courses in logic, critical thinking, and scientific reasoning and thrive on debate.

          • Well he could report whatever he wants or remembers. The limo ‘halt’ may not have stuck in his mind or seemed that important 30 years later. There are a few interviews he has given and accounts of it and he seems to give a consistent story, it’s covered on the Dankbaar site. He definitely mentions a third shooter in the drain somewhere, one of their associates. But again, it doesn’t mean there wasn’t a second team somewhere else which would account for your numbers. They didn’t need to be in contact, or even know of each other.

            Now I don’t believe one way or the other that he was there, but I do consider it possible, worth serious consideration as he is the only guy we have that might have been, and not disproven by marginal arguments as to what he ought supposedly to have stated about limo stops or suchlike if he were. He may just not consider it that important compared to having blown JFK’s brains out. Maybe if someone had asked him he would have given the answer you require anyway, but apparently no-one did. You are good on some of the detailed stuff but I don’t think you have really scrutinised this properly, or given it enough consideration, even just if to rule it out definitively. Mind you that’s just my view and you can of course take any attitude you wish.

          • Steve, For you to suggest that the driver of JFK’s limo bringing it to a halt so James Files could shoot him through the head would “not stick” in his memory demonstrates that your standards of rational belief and mine are simply not the same. Why you persist in suggesting that I have not taken him seriously is beyond me. I know Wim and he and I have had more than one exchange over this and other aspects of the assassination. So let this be the end of this discussion. You find Files credible and I do not. That’s fine with me. But there is no point in extending it here.

          • There is the possibility that the Manlicher-Carcano, set up the way it was to shoot more than two feet right at 85 yds., inadvertently provided the correct lead angle for an inexperienced shooter who held dead on at the target in the moving limo. Sometimes shit does happen.

          • Except that there is no evidence of any shots having been fired from the 6th floor. No one who actually uses rifles would prefer a misaligned scope. He was not trained to use a bolt-action weapon or to fire at moving targets or from tall buildings. And he wasn’t there. You have been taken in, alas, by the endless malarky the government and its stooges issue by the droves. I have encountered the most recent drivel in The New York Times about “the Umbrella Man”,

            http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/22/opinion/the-umbrella-man.html

            where this reader’s comment (and there are more than 250) speaks volumes about Josiah:

            23. HIGHLIGHT (What’s this?)
            Mark M
            New York, NY
            November 22nd, 2011
            6:16 am
            This was wonderful. The best – and most convincing – debunking of any and all conspiracy theories I have ever seen, and in just 6 minutes too.

            Your Submitted Comment
            Display Name
            James H. Fetzer
            Location
            Oregon, WI
            Comment
            How can Josiah Thompson have written “the definitive book” on the Zapruder film when its fabrication has been proven beyond reasonable doubt? The limo stop was removed, the wounds were changed, and, having reduced the time frame, Clint Hill’s activities–about which he has been consistent for more than 47 years–contradict what we see in the extant film. See, for example, “JFK: Who’s telling the truth: Clint Hill or the Zapruder film?” For more on how it was done, see “US Government Official: JFK Cover-Up, Film Fabrication”. For a tutorial on some of the ways we know the film we have is not the original, see John Costella, “The JFK Assassination Film Hoax”, http://assassinationscience.com/johncostella/jfk/intro/ I dismembered Josiah’s feeble defense of the authenticity of the film in THE GREAT ZAPRUDER FILM HOAX (2003). Check it out. The American people are entitled to the truth about the assassination of our 35th president. It isn’t a close call.

            The quiz for scholars of the assassination of JFK: How many falsehoods and misrepresentations did Josiah commit in this six minute presentation? I shall inventory them subsequently.

          • I haven’t been taken in by anybody, as I don’t trust anything that has been reported about this matter, and I was not there. It’s difficult enough to try to discover exactly what transpired in special operations that I did take part in. I don’t even know about how the Manlicher-Carcano actually shot, or who shot it, or if the target was moving or stopped. However, I am a good marksman, trained by the Marines on the M14 after growing up with .22s in the woods, and I have built several scoped rifles from parts myself.

            If the rifle shot off to the right and someone shot it from the book depository, aiming at the President while the limo was stopped, this could explain how Gov. Connely, sitting to the President’s right was hit. If the limo was moving, and and inexprienced shooter held on the President, giving no lead to the right, the rifle’s built-in right windage of about 2 ft. may have been just the correction required for a hit. This is what is called a deflection shot. The target was moving away somewhat faster than walking speed at some oblique angle from the shooter, not crossing his line of sight at 90 degrees. You may remember from your training that a marching man crossing the line of sight at 100 yds. requires a lead of about one arm’s lenght in front of his body. The lead required for the deflection shot will be proportionately less. We are in the range where shit could have just happened.

            Gordon Duff has said he could have made that shot with a scoped pistol, and I agree. Like other marksmen, he probably would have figured the lead (windage) before hand and dialed it into his scope so he could hold dead center on the moving target rather than use “Kentucky windage”.

          • Well, there is no evidence that Lee was on the 6th floor nor than any shots were fired from that location. There is, however, considerable evidence that he was actually in and around the 2nd floor lunchroom before the assassination, as the diagram above displays, where he was confronted by a Motorcycle Patrolman within 90 seconds after the shooting and, indeed, that he was in front of the building close to Billy Lovelady with his friend, Bill Shelly, as I have explained in the article for this comments thread.

            You do not seem to know much about the Mannlicher-Carcano. Since the death certificates, THE WARREN REPORT (1964), and articles published in the Journal of the AMA all assert JFK was killed by the impact of high-velocity rounds, he cannot have been killed by Lee Oswald, since the weapon he is supposed to have used has only a muzzle velocity of 2,000 fps and does not qualify as high-velocity, which requires muzzle velocities of 2,600 fps or higher. You want to turn the misaligned scope into a virtue, but that ignores several points.

            It had a peculiar double-action trigger, where the pull was initially gentle but then turned into a hair-trigger. The weapon was rusty and not in good condition, where experts refused to event attempt to fire it until it had been reworked and rebuilt. The M-C has the coy habit of blowing the firing pin out into the face of the shooter. The use of a scope can enhance accuracy, but consumes time. The bolt action on this weapon was so difficult, it pulled the shooter off the target, which would have to have been reacquired. Three shots in six seconds was not feasible.

            Jesse Ventura did a reenactment with stationary targets, which I arranged for him. A far better shot than Oswald, he was using an M-C in excellent condition. He tried three repetitions of three shots and could not do better than one hit in nine shots, where each sequence took several seconds longer than allocated by the “official account”. Based upon our analysis of the medical evidence and the ballistics, three shots appear to have been fired from the 2nd floor of the Dal-Tex, which I believe were fired with an unsilenced M-C. But none of this implicates Lee Oswald.

            I have no idea what “shot” you and Gordon believe you could have made, but no expert to my knowledge has replicated such a performance. An on-line video game, “JFK Reloaded”, set up a superior weapon with no recoil and a properly aligned sight, where any number of practice efforts were allowed. Thousands participated, but the highest score was around .780, which is a “C+”. So I think you are kidding yourself about this. Craig Roberts, KILL ZONE, was a successful sniper in Viet Nam and, after looking out the (then accessible) 6th floor window, concluded that the government had been lying, since he could not have made those shots, even as competent as he was.

          • For one thing, is it certain the limo ‘halted’ before the head shot(s), or could it have been momentarily after? For another, I said that he may not have considered it of particular importance even if did remember, at least to volunteer without being asked. But peering through a scope and squeezing off a shot in that context before high tailing it may have been the thing he remembers anyway after 30+ years, the halt was a momentary detail by comparison. You seem to be putting the order of likely priorites the wrong way around. As for not taking him seriously, you have said you don’t, you said he wasn’t there, based on a secondary assumed negative, so you are taking him seriously only as a bs artist. Anyway I didn’t say credible as such, but (to paraphrase) provisionally plausible.
            From your words, you “thrive on debate”, yet terminated the discussion just as it was getting interesting. Ok. As I said you seem to have made up your mind so there’s not much point.

          • Of course I have “made up my mind” about the limo stop. I’ve been studying this for 20 years. The evidence is simply overwhelming. John P. Costella, who has done the most work on the Zapruder film, has also made a compilation of witness reports from Dealey Plaza, where one after another reports that the limo was brought to a stop.

            I highly recommend that you take a look at what John has put together, “What happened on Elm Street? The Eyewitnesses Speak”, which you can find at http://www.assassinationresearch.com/v5n1/v5n1costella.pdf Check it out. You might also want to take a look at “New Proof of JFK Film Fakery”, which is archived at http://www.opednews.com/articles/opedne_jim_fetz_080205_new_proof_of_jfk_fil.htm

            And we also have multiple reports of the limo having stopped from those who have seen the “other” film, which appears to be the original of the Zapruder. There are six of whom I am aware, where the report of one of them, Rich DellaRosa, was published as an appendix to THE GREAT ZAPRUDER FILM HOAX (2003). So we know a great deal about what has been removed from the film.

          • Mr. Fetzer

            I’m not kidding myself about anything. I agree completely with the other marksmen who doubt that all the shots were fired in the specified time interval from that particular rifle. I know how difficult it is to engage multiple stationary targets across the line of sight with a scoped bolt rifle. However, I’m not talking about the possibility of multiple shots, but only one shot. Only one bullet need be proven to have come from the “Oswald rifle” to bolster the lone gunman theory that was proposed right from the start.

            Don’t you recall from your USMC training the feel of the trigger on a military rifle? There is nothing peculiar about the two-stage military trigger on the Mannlicher-Carcano, and it certainly is not “double action”.

            The 6.5X52 military cartridge has a bullet weight of 120 gr. and a muzzle velocity of 2400 fps, certainly adequate for man-killing at a range of 85 yds.

            This debate spurred me to take a look at your other article here
            http://www.veteranstoday.com/2011/11/13/reason-and-rationality-in-public-debate-the-case-of-jfk-2/
            I am reminded of George Carlin and what he called “words that just don’t seem to go together” and sure enough, I found you have made both an unreasonable and irrational analysis of the “Oswald Rifle” photos.

            In your attempt to portray these photos as being made of different rifles, you have made an assumption that not only you cannot prove, but that is also very unlikely. That is, that all three photos were made with cameras of the same format with lenses of the same focal lenght, and all from exactly the same angle of view. Differences in these optical factors can greatly affect the percieved size and shape of objects, and could make the butt stock of the rifle seem longer or shorter.

          • Well, that’s all very interesting. A guy named Ken Rahn has argued that, if bullet fragments found in the front of the limousine “matched” Mannlicher-Carcanno ammunition, then that proved Lee was the lone assassin. Mannlicher-Carcanno ammo, however, was manufactured from recycled lead, which means that a “match” would be meaningless. And even if there were a “match”, it would not show who had fired the shots or the location from which they were fired. I believe that a Mannlicher-Carcano was used to fire three shots from the Dal-Tex, which, consistent with its performance characteristics, included two misses–one that hit the curb and injured a distant bystander, the other the chrome strip above the windshield–and one hit (to the back of his head after the limo came to a stop).

            Another Mannlicher-Carcanno bullet appears to have been fired from the top of the County Records Building, probably with a 30.06 using a sabot (or plastic collar) to implant another incriminating bullet in Jack’s back. On the rifles, it’s a simple matter of the features of the weapons not being in the same relative locations. Call it “two stage” versus “double-action”, if you like. The rifle comparison was done by Jack White, by the way, who is extremely careful. Are you alleging that only one rifle was introduced into evidence? There actually appear to have been three. Only two shell casings were in evidence photos. There have been so many attempts to “bloster” the lone assassin scenrio that I am quite sure I will not have heard them all before I am gone (but hopefully not forgotten)!

          • I meant made your mind up about Files. My point or question regarding the limo stop (which I accept based on the testimony) is did it absolutely and undeniably occur before the headshot(s), or could it have been just after? Because if it was just after then your point against Files on that count is invalid, although it’s not definitive anyway for the reasons I adduced.

          • Those who have seen what appears to be the original (but which they tend to refer to as “the other film”, of whom I am aware of six), have reported that, after Greer brought the limo to an abrupt halt (which jostled the passengers forward, frames of which were kept in the revised film), JFK was hit twice in the head: once from behind (from the Dal-Tex), once from in front (the above ground sewer half-way between the road way and the top of the Triple Underpass). You can find the report of one of them, Rich DellaRosa, as Appendix E to THE GREAT ZAPRUDER FILM HOAX (2003). So far as I have been able to determine, no shot fired from Files’ location hit JFK, which is obviously one more reason to discount his claims. There are others who are as dedicated to Files as you appear to be; check out “JFKmurdersolved” and Wim Dankbaar, who agrees with you. I, however, do not.

          • Not dedicated, just interested enough to want a better dismissal than is usual, for the reasons stated. If we had the original Z. film the issue would be settled but as it is, it’s not quite. As for the trajectories, can the GN be definitively ruled out, given that the angle between there and your preferred position is not vastly different?

  18. You both mentioned Nicoletti a few times but not Sutton/Files, who whether or not he is the GK shooter as he claims (wih Nicoletti in the Dal-Tex) is a proven former associate of CN.

    Regarding the alleged pre-event conclave, MDB claimed it but is there any other proof? Because it’s been contested in detail by Dave Perry in the piece “Texas in the Imagination”.

    • Egad! Don’t you watch “The Men Who Killed Kennedy”? Nigel Turner presented powerful corroborating evidence. I do not believe Files was a shooter, but I find the Remington “Fireball” of great interest. He did not explain the limo stop, which set up his shot, if he had actually been there. My conclusion is that he did not mention it because he was not there. Plus there were many more shooters than he suggests and the idea that he could have been introduced into the assassination on the day it occurred is beyond ridiculous. That is completely absurd.

      • Haven’t seen it though I will look out for it (have read of it though). The whereabouts of LBJ and Nixon (and Hoover?) would be the main points, which Perry claims were credibly attested elsewhere (which he details).

        Files says he was tracking JFK through his scope and counting off the shots/misses before he fired, which in theory could have been his focus and recall without reference to the stop as such (especially as he supposedly had orders not to hit Jackie). He only claims to have been part of one team with Nicoletti and Roselli, but not that they were necessarily the only team. But he claims to have been involved with the prep and setup, and was a longtime driver and backup to Nicoletti, so being tipped on the day to provide direct backup in case the others missed (he was up to that point just supposed to drive the getaway car – as far as he knew) is not unbelievable in itself. There were clearly some improv and screw-ups afoot that day. He has some corroboration for at least some involvement. But some things don’t seem to fully check out, like his account of his service in Laos. So who knows for sure.

        • Steve, my only advantage over Dave Perry is that I have collaborated with the best-qualified individuals to ever study the assassination since 1992, including a world-authority on the human brain, a Ph.D. in physics who is also an M.D. and board certified in radiation oncology, another M.D. who was presented during the treatment of JFK in Trauma Room #1 and then, two days later, was responsible for the care of his alleged assassin, a legendary photo and film analyst, and another Ph.D. in physics, this time with a specialization in electromagnetism, the properties of light and of images of moving objects.

          I am a professional scholar who has published more than a hundred articles and (at present) 29 books, including ASSASSINATION SCIENCE (1998), MURDER IN DEALEY PLAZA (2000), and THE GREAT ZAPRUDER FILM HOAX (2003). We reconstructed the case from the ground up and began with the autopsy X-rays and autopsy report. We found that virtually all of the evidence that has been cited by THE WARREN REPORT (1964) and CASE CLOSED (1992), for example, is planted, fabricated, or fake.

          You are welcome to compare our qualifications, accomplishments, and research with that of Dave Perry or anyone else you like, but the objective of disinformation is to make everything believable and nothing knowable. What I am reporting in this article concerns what we have established to be the case. The government, especially the CIA, runs an on-going disinformation campaign in its efforts to preserve an unjustified “veil of uncertainty” regarding what is known about the death of JFK. Why don’t you take a good look at the evidence I present in the books and articles I cite to make a more informed judgement about what is known and what remains unknown.

          • I’m not questioning your qualifications generally, but simply what the hard evidence is for the Murchison meet to back up MDB over the claims in Perry’s article re the whereabouts of the people in question which were allegedly certified elsewhere by witnesses. You answered to view the documentary which I will get around to eventually. But it’s a fair question as obviously MDB’s story if true would be a clincher in certain regards. On the other hand given your judgement of my standards of belief compared to yours reading your books may not be that useful, although from what I have seen I do think the Zap. film was tampered with, though mainly because of the eyewitness testimony which the technical aspects back up if somewhat subtly.

          • Well, Nigel Turner tracked down the chauffuer who drove J. Edgar to the meeting and the chef who prepared the meal, who confirmed Madeleine’s story. As I recall, there was also a note about it published in the local newspaper. We we discussed it, I found everything she said about it to fit together. As I recall, Lyndon called her the morning of the assassination and repeated what he had said the night before–that, after today, he would not have to put up with embarrassment from those Kennedy boys and that that was not a threat, it was a promise! She has a book about and Lyndon’s complicity has been substantiated by other sources. There are many who are dedicated to concealing and obfuscating the truth about JFK.

          • That sounds solid enough on Hoover then, which would bear out MDB’s story substantially as to Johnson also, Nixon perhaps remains a question, also in light of some of his later behaviour that perhaps indicates a less than full knowledge of proceedings.
            As for those dedicated to concealment and obfuscation, one would think that by now they would begin to realize that it’s maybe better the truth finally come out, the principals are gone or just about, and the country is getting so deep in the muck that it might never get out, due to just that sort of thing. But then they probably think it would compromise future potential for the same sort of thing which will only screw things up even more. That is to say the ones that even think about it as opposed to merely taking their paychecks. What a brain-dead state the US is in on so much, if only it didn’t matter.

      • Information on the treason, traitors, and sociopaths who participated in this crime will continue to surface until the end of time or until the plot unravels, whichever comes first. They and their rotten hoodlum friends will be exposed. One. By. One.

        http://www.analysis-news.com/Gdetailfolder/Goldsmiths-130.htm

        As the original degenerates rot and die, some crusty old stragglers will hide or run with the cash, but others may not want to carry such a hateful burden of sludge to the end, and reclaim some semblance of decency by exposing lies.

      • You can find the individual frames for the improved Zapruder film (which has been corrected by John for both pincushion and aspect-ratio distortion, where missing frames have been restored and others out of order have been fixed) as well as a stabilized version of the film, which makes it easier to follow. You can find it–and John’s visual tutorial–on assassinationscience.com

        The frames that show the passengers being jostled forward at the time the limo is supposed to be accelerating occur immediately following the head shot at frame 313. It is difficult to take your eyes off of JFK, but if you watch Connally and his wife and Greer and Kellerman, you will see that they are thrust forward, when they should instead have been pulled back, were the film geniune.

        Eyewitness reports are often lampooned as “unreliable”, a study conducted at Harvard showed that, regarding features of situations that viewers regarded as salient (important), they displayed recollections that were 98% accurate and 98% complete. Those revising the apparently thought they had to keep them in lest eyewitnesses recall them and dispute the authenticity of the film.

        • Doesn’t this weaken the “no planes” theory even further then?

        • I thought I did in a previous thread. Such as that the plane could have been hitting a (somehow) pre-weakened section that offered little resistance. Or was itself somehow hardened or otherwise given increased penetrative capacity in the nose. The airspeed limit I recall is not an absolute impossibility for that brief span, as AL pointed out.

          • This is like the “garage door” theory, where that section of the South Tower was blown open at the precise moment the plane touched for which, as in the case of your theory, there is simply no evidence that supports it. Go back to “Inside Job: More Proof of 9/11 Duplicity” and review that it was intersecting eight (8) floors of steel trusses covered with 4-8″ of concrete. But I invited you to offer what you take to be a better theory. Let’s continue this on that thread, if you don’t mind, however, since it has nothing to do with JFK.

  19. Right, Jim, when Tom Valentine introduced my three-part series in The National Exchange, “Not A Castro Plot, But Politics of the Times Led to Kennedy’s Death,” on this note on the full front-page of the April 1978 issue, it still meant nothing:

    “(Editor’s Note: Professor Trowbridge H. Ford of Holy Cross College took issue with the Kennedy Assassination theories which claimed that the popular President was killed upon the order of Cuba’s Fidel Castro. Ford, a Political Science professor, studied the politicial climate of the times and brought forth the following thesis. EX-CHANGE does not accuse anyone of the crime, but we are granting Professor Ford a vehicle for his astute commentary. Other publications have rejected Professor Ford’s work, not because it is inaccurate or careless, but because the facts seem too hot to handle. You have not read this in any other publication and EXCHANGE is proud to bring you this assassination viewpoint in two or more parts: this is the first installment.”

    In short, I am not the slightest bit embarrassed or upset about my claims, and if you still have ones, take them up with Editor Tom Valentine.

    • Well, for April 1978, I think you were doing just fine! But, in case you haven’t noticed, that was even before the publication of David Lifton’s BEST EVIDENCE (1980), the release of documents and records by the Assassination Records Review Board, and the scientific studies published in my three books (1998), (2000), and (2003), not to mention Doug Horne’s INSIDE THE ARRB (2009). So, yes, you did great, back in the old days, Trowbridge. And I don’t have to consult anyone to make that observation.

      But conclusions that may have been justifiable then are long out-of-date and do not comport with the evidence we have available to us now. Just compare my summary of what we know now with what you knew then. I agree: Castro had nothing to do with it. But I cannot understand why you are so reluctant to bring yourself up-to-date by actually studying the research presented in the five books I have cited here. You need to go back to work on JFK. Cease this nostalgia for the past and catch up!

  20. Since men from Texas were responsible for murdering our greatest President (Kennedy) they OWE us full disclosure of all the records and the bringing to justice ALL those involved NO MATTER how many years after the fact.

    This murder will not go away until ALL are brought to justice. The American people demand it.

  21. I am not about to give “us” a break by going away when you are just spinning what you want us to believe.

    I was asked by Representative Henry Gonzalez to outline my theory about the assassination for the HSCA while I was writing the three-part series about the assassination for The National Exchange – guess Valentine is out of his depth too.

    And you believe people like Sol Estes, McClelland, and Hunt when it comes to the Dallas assassination.

    Hunt is a totally unreliable witness – the disinformation agent who forged the JFK cables about assassinating Diem & Nhu for Nixon’s White House, and went to Milwaukee to implicate the Democrats in Bremer’s attempted assassination of Governor Wallace – what Harvey’s Plumbers had actually arranged.

    You will believe anyone as long as it suits your covering up who really killed JFK.

    And I think that about six to eight bullets were fired at JFK, and about three of them hit each him and Connally, fired from the sixth floor of the TSBD and another site, probably the grassy knoll by Alderisio, though I still don’t think every detail about the shootings must be made perfectly clear. They and posssibly others are the killers.

    • Well, this comment further substantiates your ignorance. No shots appear to have been fired from the 6th floor window. If you were current with the objective, scientific research that I published in ASSASSINATION SCIENCE (1998), MURDER IN DEALEY PLAZA (2000), and THE GREAT ZAPRUDER FILM HOAX (2003), you would be far better informed that you are. Judgments about credibility have to be rendered against a background of knowledge about the case and how they fit together with what else is known. Your eagerness to dismiss accounts by persons who were far better positioned to know what was happening than you and especially your dismissal of a fine woman, Madeleine Duncan Brown, as “a liar” simply because what she has to tell us is discrepant with your own meager understanding speaks volumes about your research methodology, absence of ethics and lack of human decency. I am sorry, Trowbridge, but none of your posts are advancing our knowledge about the assassination of JFK. They are, however, extremely revealing of your lack of knowledge and incomprehension of the evidence in this case. Since JFK was hit four times–in the throat from in front, in the back from behind, and twice in the head (from behind and from in front), it is painfully apparent that you are not even minimally qualified to discuss this case, much less display arrogance and pomposity. You are a sad case of a man being caught up in a time-warp of his own importance.

  22. The last episode in the 9 Part Series done by the History Channel is a eye opener. Well worth the time to watch. It can be found at WRH.com or at the link below:

    http://www.personalgrowthcourses.net/video/assassinations/men_who_killed_kennedy_9_assassinations

    The Men Who Killed Kennedy – Part 9
    Tags:

    ASSASSINATION
    COVER-UP/DECEPTIONS/PROPAGANDA
    HIDDEN HISTORY

    This is the final segment of “The Men Who Killed Kennedy” that claims Lyndon Johnson was part of the group that assassinated John F. Kennedy. The Johnson family threatened to sue History Channel, which is why this segment, preserved at this link, is not included in the DVD set or aired when the rest of the segments are broadcast.

    Johnson’s motive for wanting Kennedy killed was not just to become President, but because Johnson had learned from one of his staffers, who roomed with Kennedy party-girl Mary Jo Kopechne (later to die in Ted Kennedy’s car when he was run off the road at Chappaquiddick), that John F. Kennedy was going to replace him as Vice President in the second term, which would have ended Johnson’s White House aspirations.

  23. Thank you for those kind words, Solfeggio, which I greatly appreciate. The truth about JFK still matters.

  24. You can interview a person who is lying a million times and not obtain the truth – what the dropped Ms. Brown engaged in with you about LBJ et al.

    And then you just go on and on about your authority – what I distinctly remember your attacking by others in the copy of Assassination Science which you sent me without my even knowing about it, much less requesting it.

    And sometimes one just has to do some creative thinking – what I did when I figured out what happened in Rose’s restaurant in Chicago when Cain was blasted away for failing to test fire the rifle which almost killed Connally – what I have yet to see you demonstrate.

    • That I have been collaborating with experts on the medical, ballistic, and photographic evidence–about which I have published three books!–suggests that there are good reasons why I have knowledge about them that you do not possess. Appealing to authorities in an area, such as medicine, in which they are authorities is non-fallacious. Your posts reek with incompetence. And I am quite sure everyone has noticed that you have not answered the questions I have posed about how many times JFK was shot, the locations from which those bullets were fired, the multiple indications of Secret Service complicity in setting him up for the hit, what happened to the body, the X-rays and the autopsy photographs–and for good reason. You are hopelessly ignorant. Give it a rest, Trowbridge. You are embarrassing yourself beyond measure. Stay with stuff you understand–and, by the way, what Madeleine had to tell us was confirmed by Billy Sol Estes, Barr McClellend, and E. Howard Hunt, with respect to Lyndon’s involvement and that of Cord Meyer, David Atlee Philips, William Harvey, and David Sanchez Morales. Give us a break. I just don’t understand why you would present ourself as an authority on the assassination when you have clearly demonstrated that you know so little about it.

    • Mr. Ford,
      I learned the following in 2002 while researching for a new rifle scope design, not the Kennedy assassination.

      The Manlicher-Carcano carbine in question was one of a lot of such rifles sold by Klein’s Sporting Goods in Chicago. All of the rifles in this lot had scope mounts that were misaligned during installation. This is probably one of the reasons they were being discounted by Klein’s at $10 each. The Dallas rifle was tested after the crime and found to print three feet to the right at 100 yds. with the scope windage adjustment set fully to the left. The the rifle was returned to Mrs. Oswald who promptly sold it to a private collector and no further tests of the weapon have bee made public.

      Oswald supposedly practiced with the rifle at a lake outside of town, but the range he shot at is not known. Then his is reported to have missed an easy shot at General Wallace (off to the right by a foot or so) who stood at his kitchen window.

      If the rifle were zeroed to print three feet right at 100 yds., it would shoot about two feet right at 85 yds., the range to the limo.

  25. I am not addressing the ones you are because they leave you grabbing for Madeleine Brown to tell us who the conspirators were – a group of wantabe old officials and politicians who couldn’t hit the side of a barn with a weapoin – when Sam Giancana’s relatives were more reliable witnesses about what Cain, Nicoletti, and Sam himself did.

    When Momo learned that Cain – aka “the man with the package” which Crafard supplied – had been too outspoken about his handiwork with Connally, he was blasted away in a Chicago restaurant.

    When Mono learned that Harvey had set him for the Dallas assassination, and threatened to tell the Church Committee about it all, Harvey himself took him out.

    And then Chuckie was shot, and burned up in a car.

    You just abuse the idea of authority to get support for your endless red-herrings, and points which lead nowhere.

    • Well, I actually know the medical evidence, have spent time on the ballistics, and studied the photographs and films. Those who were at the ratification meeting, including LBJ, Nixon, and John J. McCloy, were not shooters. The only advantage Madeleine has over you is that she was actually there. Unlike you, I had more than 100 conversations with her, including an interview during the JFK Lancer Conference in 1998. I organized the first Zapruder film symposium there in 1996. Those with whom I have collaborated (and who contributed to my books) include a world authority on the human brain who was also an expert on wound ballistics, a Ph.D. in physics who is also an M.D. and board-certified in radiation oncology, a physician who was present during the treatment of JFK and then, two days later, was responsible for attending to his alleged assassin, a legendary photo and film analyst, and another Ph.D. in physics, who has a specialization in electromagnetism, the properties of light and images of moving objects. Plus I read the manuscripts, listened to his audio and video interviews, and actually met the third of the tramps, who, as a contract agent for the CIA, prepared 15 sets of forged Secret Service credentials for use in and around Dealey Plaza. What qualifies you for such arrogance? So far as I can see, you have done some spitballing and shallow thinking about the mob having done it, when this was far more complicated–too complicated, it appears, for you to grasp. Everyone can see that one of us has no idea what he is talking about.

  26. With all your minute discussion of these matters, all you can come up with is suspicions about the shoots coming from the buildings around Dealey Square, and the leading conspirators being various politicians and officials who obviously did not fire a shot, you work is essentially pointless, much less helpful than what Sam Giancana’s relatives said about another double cross in the conspiracy – i. e., Harvey’s setting up Sam to take the fall for killing the President if it became necessary because of what his underlings had done behind his back, and then Cain being killed for accidentally almost killing Connally, Harvey himself taking out Momo when he threatened to spill the beans about the whole plot to the Church Committe, and then Chuckie being shot and burned up in a car.

    Much better identification of who the shooters were, how they did their dirty work, and why it all, fortunately for us, went for naught.

    You just constantly fuzz up the real issues by your false claims of authority, and by coopting the various specialists about aspects of shootings who don’t have a clue about what was really going in this case to bolster it more.

  27. Without knowledge of the medical evidence, you cannot construct the ballistics, and without the ballistics, you cannot know the locations of the shooters. Obviously, you have no knowledge of the photographic or of the film evidence. Which means that, by your own admission, you are unqualified and incompetent to be addressing these questions. Q.E.D.

  28. Just more pathetic nonsense by you, Professor Fetzer.

    I am not interested in the medical evidence, being a student of politics who is interested in political activities, particularly conspiracy assassinations. I soon learned that JFK was assassinated by a group of Mafia killers, not LHO, and that was good enough for me.

    As usual, forgot to mention my including *Milwaukee Phil’ Alderisio being one of them, and whose contribution could well satisfy the required bullets.

    And as for your bullshit about sending me the copy of Sprague’s manuscript, you overlooked that I had recently moved to Sweden from Portugal, but you somehow managed to find my address, as the envelope clearly showed:

    Trowbridge Ford, Ph.D.
    9 Sporrvagen
    18141 Lidingo
    Sweden

    As for my work on the JFK assassination, on the same page of the Sprague manuscript, he usaed my article about Gerald Ford and the Warren Commission as the basis of Nixon getting LBJ to put him on the Warren Commission, and there were several articles by me in Computers and Automation

    For what they are, and where you can find them, I suggest you consult its issues, and those ofr Computers and People, published by Berkeley Enterprises, Inc. whose address is supplied at the bottom of the manuscript, p. 22.

    Your dealing with the Sprague piece, and how I recevied brings into question much more than your findings, especially your integrity.

    Then there is the three-party serious that Tom Valentine publishe in 1978 in The National Exchange.

    The best bit of evidence to blow your claims is the Chairman’s Letter that Jim DiEugenio had for the special edition of Probe magazine in January 1996, claiming that I was the covert operator who brought down Nixon – a complete lie which I only wish was true. At that time, Probe was led not only by that totally unscrupulous Jim but also Jim Marrs and Jack White.

    As for your list of Kennedy’s killers, it still gets a completely failing grade.

  29. I have a sense of importance in this matter, Professor Fetzer, because you sought me out, providing me not only with a copy of Assassination Science, but also one of Richard E. Sprague’s The Taking of America, 1-2-3.which you asked me to study aka FYS, and which you have misrepresented the content of.

    You recently said that Sprague had claimed that Nixon was behind the JFK assassination when Sprague said I was: “Whether Nixon was direcly involved in the PCG’s planning for the assassination is still open to question, although one research believes that he was.” (p. 78) The sentence has footnote #10 added to it, and at the bottom is this:

    10. Trowbridge Ford, Holy Cross College, Boston MA, Several papers and articles.

    As for you pathetic lie about not knowing anything about me, the copy of Sprague’s manuscript was sent airmail from JHF/Philospophy, University of Minnesota, Duluth, Minnesot 55812 on APR-3’98. I had never heard of you until then.

    As for you questions about what Cain and Nicoletti did, you are wrong in stating that I have ever said that Cain helped kill Kennedy. Cain almost killed Connally because he had failed to test fire the rifle that Larry Crafard had placed there for him, resulting in his being murdered in a Chicago restaurant when the conspiracy plot threatened to become exposed. Phil Alderisio and Chuckie killed JFK.

    Those gunmen of Giancana’s had nothing to do with the threats breaking down the President’s security. They were accomplished by the ads that Jack Ruby placed in the DMN, allegedly about the activities at the Carousel Club but actually parts of the plot. The threats were triggered by the ad about “Twist Board” while the plot to entrap LHO was “Little Egypt” – what caused so much trouble for Ruby since there was a belly dancer with that name, and she was threatening action against him for saying so becuase she would not be seen dead in the slimey joint.

    And Ruby was in the ad office when the President was killed, wanting to make sure that everything had gone according to plan – not at the entrance of the TSBD as you also falsely claimed. Of course, when Cain hit Connally, the shit hit the fan, and he rushed off to Parkland to see how the Governor was faring.

    In sum, I have found nothing in your claims which really expose the real plotters, especially the most important forgotten one, NSA Director General Gordon Blake who handled the basic component of it by making it seem by the apparent downing of Captain Joe Glenn Hyde’s U-2 that Castro had still IRBMs in Cuba, contrary to the terms of the Missile Crisis settlement.

    I shall continue to contradict your false claims by you and others until they stop or you all leave.

    • Contradict all you like. Apparently, you made no impression upon me then, but you are making up for it in spades with your ridiculous remarks. Your knowledge of the case–which is really your heart-felt beliefs about it, for which you appear to have little or no actual proof–does not extend to the medical evidence, the ballistic evidence, or the photographic and film evidence. Let me fathom the depth of your understanding: how many times was JFK hit? where was he hit? where were the shooters located? who were they? what was done to obfuscate the wounds? how extensive was the cover-up? what happened to his skull? what happened to his throat wound? what was done with the home movies?

      You claim that Richard Cain and Chuckie Nicoletti were shooters, where Cain was firing at Connally. That only leaves Chuckie Nicoletti to be shooting at JFK. But he was hit four times: in the throat (from in front); in the back (from behind); and twice in the head (from the back left and from the right front). Is it your contention that Chuckie Nicoletti fired these four shots from widely disparate locations? I hope you can see why I find your position more than faintly indefensible. And I can’t wait to have your answers to the questions about the assassination that I have raised above. Were they also controlling the Secret Service in setting JFK up for the hit? Please tell us more of your theory of the murder of our president.

      You appear to be to have taken a little here and a little there to fashion a pastiche of impressions that you pass off as you account of the case. But apart from one reference in Sprague to an article or two you wrote at Holy Cross, I can find no sources on your having published anything serious about the assassination. I gather you think you are some fountain of wisdom, where perhaps in the past some have been taken in by your shallow thoughts. Well, kindly spare me. From everything I can tell, when it comes to JFK, you are a complete idiot, which is a term that I am using to apply to someone who repeatedly asserts himself in matters of which his knowledge or understanding is extremely limited or non-existent.

      Answer my questions, Trowbridge. If I sent you a copy of ASSASSINATION SCIENCE (1998), then if you read it you would know far more about the case than you have displayed here at VT. From what I can see, you even think that your denials of points I have made qualify as arguments. But for that you need evidence. Of course Lyndon, Nixon, J. Edgar, and many others, such as Clint Murchison, H.L. Hunt, George Brown, and John J. McCloy were involved. In case you missed it, they were all at the “ratification” meeting at the home of Murchison the night before, as Madeleine Duncan Brown reported and as Nigel Turner confirmed. I am sorry, but I find your bickering tedious and boring, which seem to be your defining traits.

  30. Hi Jim. Thanks for all the important work you’ve done on this vitally important subject! Do you think JFK’s insistence that Israel stops it building of nuclear weapons had anything to do with his assassination? Also, do you think they switched brains on Air Force 1 when Johnson made Jackie Kennedy leave the coffin and stand next to him when he was sworn in?

    Progress! Bob Johnson
    http://www.deism.com

    • As of this point in time, I have discovered no indications of Israeli/Mossad involvement. The brain exchange came later (at Bethesda) after they had altered the X-rays to conceal the massive blow-out at the back of his head. Once that was “patched”, there was no where for all that brain tissue to go–so the effected a substitution of a much larger and virtually totally intact brain.

  31. I was 8 1/2 years old when this day became “history”. What I remember is alot of confused, pissed-off, “justice now” adults. (Sounds like the day of 9/11 from my adult perspective that day). The catholic family next door (8 stairstep kids) was in mourning for a good month. And that was in the “boonies” of Victoria, TX.

    I only began to question the “official LIE” of JFK’S death around 2005. Coincidentally, the same time I began to research/question the “official 9/11 LIE”. I guess history does repeat, and the bigger the lie the more that will buy.

    The LAME-STREAM-MEDIA and the “death” of investigative journalism have certainly attained the highest level of propaganda possible. Most younger than I will probably never connect with the importance of this information. Too bad, because this laid-the-tracks for the “death train” WE are strapped into. Most of this is still over my head, but wish I had seen it 30 years ago.

  32. If these facts are a given, when do the indictments start to go out? Many/most of those involved are old or dead, but once the public is made aware, Jenny bar the door. Could be the straw that breaks the camel’s back and hell breaks loose in this country. I want to be the fly on the wall.

  33. In addition to the above, we have the new disclosure by the son of Howard Hunt who made a “Death Bed Confession” as follows: Part 1 From: TheTruthSeeker.co.uk

    truthjihad.blogspot.com – November 19, 2011

    Of all the big lies told about the JFK assassination, perhaps the biggest is: “I guess we’ll never really know what happened.”

    Bullshit! We do know.

    Some of us know because we have studied the issue. Others, like Saint John Hunt, son of CIA executive and covert action agent E. Howard Hunt, know because they got it straight from the horse’s mouth.

    In 1979, as a 20-year-old undergraduate, I wrote an article for the Madison, WI Daily Cardinal compiling evidence that the CIA killed JFK. Shortly after the article was submitted to a dozen or so publications, but before it was published, a woman appeared at my house and very politely announced she was a CIA-operated mind-control slave, brain wired with electrodes, whose job was to target enemies of the CIA for elimination. The next day, I asked my politically-savvy journalism professor, John T. McNelly, what was THAT about. He said, “They’re just f**ing with you, kid. They’re trying to intimidate you.”

    Saint John Hunt knows how badly “they” can f** with you. He helped his CIA-agent father Howard conceal money and documents during the Watergate scandal, and suffered the pain of having his mother, Dorothy Hunt, blown out of the sky under circumstances that are far beyond suspicious.

    So Saint John Hunt gets my vote as one America’s greatest living heroes, for having the guts to stand up and tell the truth about his father’s confession to participating in the LBJ-approved, CIA-orchestrated assassination of John F. Kennedy. His family didn’t want him to do it, the lawyers didn’t want him to do it, and of course the CIA didn’t want him to do it. But Saint John Hunt chose to live up to his arrangement with his dying father, who apparently felt some ambivalent remorse about his participation in “The Big Event” and, at the end of his life, asked his son to help expose the truth. By doing so, Saint John Hunt is not only keeping faith with his father, but also keeping faith with his country and its tortured, slowly dying Constitution. And if you believe, as I do, that one of God’s highest names is al-Haqq (truth/reality), Saint John Hunt is keeping faith on that level as well.
    11/18/2011 Interview with Saint John Hunt, lightly edited, Part 1 (Listen to the full interview here – scroll halfway through the mp3 to the second hour of the show)

    Saint John Hunt
    (The JFK assassination) happened 49 years ago this November 22nd. That’s basically a generation. And the old generation has published, I don’t know, 500 books on the subject, noting all manner of conspiracies from every conceivable source – everything from the CIA to space aliens.

    We were well warned by Eisenhower, when he passed the torch to JFK, that we’ve got a very dangerous situation here with the miltary-industrial-congressional complex – that’s what was left out of his speech, the word “congressional.” Those were (Eisenhower’s) words, and he was correct in that appraisal.

    Kevin Barrett
    You’ve laid it on the line in a way that few have. I mean, this is your father that we’re talking about! It must be really, really tough, (dealing with) the feeling of betrayal that we all have when we look into issues like this, when (we find) our own government has betrayed us, our own government has slaughtered 3000 people in the World Trade Center and blamed it on their enemies. People in our own government, the people really in charge, kill the President, kill his brother, and so on. We all feel a horrible sense of betrayal. But having it in the family must be worse. It must be like betrayal squared.

    Hunt
    Yeah, it was a pretty big shock when he called me down to his, we’ll say his death bed side in Florida. And of course I had heard and seen…I had even attended a lecture in the mid-1970s by a comedian-turned-activist named Dick Gregory at San Francisco State. He was one of the first, along with Mark Lane and Silvia Meagher. And of course they accused my father of being one of the agents involved. So I was well aware that there were a lot of accusations flying around, and I just wanted to sort of figure things out for myself. But I kind of dropped the issue for ten or twenty years, until I got this phone call from my father. And lo and behold, there was some truth to the accusations and the alleged evil deeds. So that was quite a shock. And the arrangement that I had with him…originally we were going to bring it out together, before he passed away. But there was so much pressure from the inner family circle, and from various lawyers, and of course the CIA itself, that he backed down.

    Barrett
    What year was this happening?

    Hunt
    This was in 2005. And so he decided that he couldn’t really come out with this information himself, while he was alive, because there would be too many repercussions. First of all, he was extremely worried that any up-and-coming hotshot lawyer would have him arrested for complicity in the death of the President, which there is no statute of limitations on. So he backed down. And of course his family was deeply distressed over the overwhelming repercussions this would have in their lives. His second family, which we’re talking about, were relatively untainted by the things he had done when I, and my sisters and brothers and his first wife, were his main family. So he was a gentle man, toward the end there. But his wish for me was for me to bring this out after he had passed away. And of course that weighed very heavily on my shoulders. He passed away in 2007. After two years I just said “I’ll do this.” Against all pleas from my family, I decided to go ahead.

    Barrett
    Wow. That must be tough.
    I know there’s a tape and a handwritten letter (confession to participation in CIA execution of JFK). Did he give you those in 2005?

    Hunt
    He gave me the handwritten notes in 2005, I believe. That’s when we were both working on how to bring this out to the mainstream media. He sent me the tape after I left. I just found it in the mail one day. I opened up the mail, and it was in an envelope. I put the cassette in and it was my father saying, on this audio cassette, how he was part of this “Big Event” (CIA code for its JFK asassination plot), naming the key players that he spoke with, that were arranging this. He ended the tape by saying that this information was for me and me alone.

    We had had a very dynamic relationship. He was a staunch conservative Republican, while by that age, I was 17 in 1969 and very much part of the antiwar movement. So we had our differences, but we had always been very truthful with each other. And we had a bond of secrecy that really developed on the night of June 17th (1972) when he came home from Watergate. I was part of those crazy shennanigans, and I helped him dispose and disseminate lots of information, cash, money, you know. He trusted me with those. I never came forward and told anybody about it.

    Barrett
    Was he set up on Watergate? What’s your take on that?

    Hunt
    Yeah, I believe Watergate was a set-up job. I think my father – I know my father was part of that set-up.
    The interesting thing is that although my father claimed to have retired from the CIA in 1970. And then in early 1971 he was asked by Charles Colson, one of Nixon’s advisors, to work under Mr. Colson in the White House in a special projects team that later became known as the Plumbers. But the truth of the matter is, and my father told me this years later, was that he never resigned from the CIA. Now he had had left the CIA twice before, and they were both false exits. They were so that he could have a new cover, yet still tapped into all the necessary CIA drop sources and do his job as an agent. So even in 1970, when he officially retired from the CIA, that was a third false exit from the CIA. He was still with the CIA, still on their books, still having meetings with Dick Helms and other top people at the CIA about Watergate and what Nixon was doing. So the CIA had my father there (in Nixon’s Plumbers) as what they call a “mole,” a deep agent, a double agent. So whatever was going on, the CIA was very well aware of it, because my father was reporting back to them on everything that was going down, all these crazy plots: kidnapping people, renting houseboats with prostitutes in them during the Democratic Convention in Miami, Florida, breaking into the George Wallace shooter, Arthur Bremer’s apartment – Colson sent (Hunt) up to Milwaukee to break into Bremer’s apartment and plant pro-McGovern literature so that Bremer would look like a leftist.

    Barrett
    That’s pretty weird, isn’t it?

    Hunt
    That’s just so crazy to me.

    Barrett
    I don’t know if you’ve seen Gore Vidal’s essay on (Howard Hunt’s connection to Bremer and the Wallace shooting, etc.). He’s kind of hard on your father. And he points out that Bremer, who had something like a 65 IQ and was marginally literate, left an “assassin’s diary” that reminds one of the prose style of the spy novels of Howard Hunt.

    Hunt
    Yeah, that was alleged to have been written by my father, and it really wouldn’t surprise me, because my father was a ghost writer for, let me give you an example, Allan Dulles, one of the Dulles brothers. The two Dulles brothers, Allan Dulles and John Foster Dulles…Allan Dulles was head of the CIA before Dick Helms, I believe, and his brother John Foster Dulles was head of United Fruit Company, as well as many other corporations that had interests in Latin American businesses. And when Allan Dulles was planning his retirement from the CIA, he wanted to publish a novel, you know, his autobiography, which was actually written by my father, along with Allan Dulles. That’s a little-known fact.

    Barrett
    I remember reading that, back in the day, and noticing that the passages about JFK just dripped with venom.

    Hunt
    Well, JFK was one of the most hated presidents, politically speaking, of all of our presidents, with possibly the exception of Abraham Lincoln. He was much-loved by almost all of the public. But…

    Barrett
    But not in the intelligence community.
    (music) We’ll be back in a moment. I’m talking with Saint John Hunt.

    To be continued…

    Source

    • Well, I know the St. John story, but his father was a “back bencher” who did not participate (even though he was there) and the third “tramp” was Chauncey Marvin Holt, not E. Howard Hunt. (I organized a symposium on the identity of the third tramp with Chauncey’s daughter, Karyn, and wife, Mary, at the Lancer Conference in Dallas in 2000, which you can obtain from Lancer.) But Hunt’s list of those involved was a good one, even if a bit limited. This was a very large scale operation that was meticulously planned down to the last detail.

  34. And this is the blockbuster we have been waiting for?

    So who assassinated JFK? I have an alibi, being at the British Museum doing research when it happened, and have witnesses who can testify to this effect.

    Do you?

    I still go with my dirty dozen, and will continue to do so until someone supplies even an iota of evidence to refute it.

    • A lot of people were involved, Trowbridge. I have laid out the case in many places, which, so far as I can see, you have not bothered to study. Why should anyone pay any attention to you? And I don’t understand why you presume you are right and others are wrong. Until you started attacking me (apparently for stepping on your toes) I had never even heard of you–and I have been doing serious JFK research for nearly twenty years, now. So it simply baffles me why you seem to have such a sense of self-importance. You are a trivial person, Trowbridge.

      Just out of curiosity, since you believe that Richard Cain and Chuckie Nicoletti killed JFK, were they also responsible for more than 15 indications of Secret Service complicity in setting him up for the hit? Where were they located and how many shots did they fire? Were they able to steal the body from Parkland and alter the appearance of the wounds at Bethesda? Were they in the position to alter the autopsy X-rays and photographs? Or to substitute someone else’s brain for that of JFK? I am sorry, Trowbridge, but you are completely out of your depth regarding JFK.

      • Charlotte NC Bill

        Yup…the CIA and Mossad/Meyer Lansky Jewish mob…The shooters in the grassy knoll? Imports..The CIA set it all up..They groomed the patsy ( much like getting the arab patsies on 9-11 their student visas and paying their bills ) and got him as close to the action as possible…The CIA didn’t like Jack’s snub during the Bay of Pigs invasion…The “anti-communists” were upset at taking our missiles out of Turkey and his re-thinking the Vietnam adventure ( see his sit-down w/Gen MacArthur in NYC )..The Zio-scum hated his strenuous efforts to keep Talmudia nuclear free and requiring the American Zionist Congress to register as agents of a foreign govt…A Judeo-Masonic hit..

    • From Fred Burks for PEERS and the WantToKnow.info Team

      “Important note on 48th anniversary of JFK’s death: In 2003, the History Channel completed an amazingly revealing nine-part series titled “The Men Who Killed Kennedy.” The ninth and final episode provides powerful evidence that Lyndon Johnson was directly involved in JFK’s assassination. In the first minute his lawyer states, “I know as attorney for Lyndon Johnson that he murdered John Kennedy.” Johnson’s family and supporters successfully threatened History Channel, so that they no longer air or sell this key final segment of the series. Yet we obtained a copy and have posted it to our video section. If you are ready to have your eyes opened, watch even the first few minutes of this most powerful documentary available at this link.”
      http://www.personalgrowthcourses.net/video/assassinations/men_who_killed_kennedy_9_assassinations

      MY NOTE: This series showed nine different theories; hence nine parts. The link above is the one the History Channel did not broadcast, and won’t sell.

      Fred Burks partial bio:
      “Fred Burks – Before resigning from the US State Department in 2004 due to excessive secrecy demands, Fred Burks served many years as a language interpreter for presidents and other dignitaries. He interpreted for Bush, Clinton, Gore, Cheney, and many other top officials of the US and other countries. Having participated in numerous secret meetings where the only people allowed were the principals and their interpreters, he has acquired important inside information and contacts.”

      (You can read the rest on his site: http://www.wanttoknow.info/ )

      Hope you can view from Sweden, otherwise you will have to install a free Virtual Private Network (VPN) to spoof living in the USA.

      This film is gripping, and contains information that you’ve never heard before. At least, not in the last ten years.

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  1. Jack Heart: Thank you LC but I'm just the guy who slings the prose, Orage and others supply the facts. I've probably learned almost as much as my readers writing these things.
  2. Mike Kay: K., Thank you for observing the role of religion in the current milieu. Personally, I wish it weren't so, but quite plainly, it very much is. The three predominate religions are ...
  3. Jack Heart: And you won't either Regina as I Clower noted in the comments below. Anything about the Shauberger technology now under the current conditions is sure to launch a lynch mob ...
  4. Mike Kay: Dr. Barret, You are a highly intelligent and learned man. You have directed much of your formidable intellect toward the education of you fellow man, a very noble goal sir. Please ...
  5. Mike Kay: T., Thank you for the words of support, they are few and far in between. Hatred of the psychopathy is both good and natural. The desire to kill the perps should ...

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