The MH17 Shoot Down over Ukraine

Baby doll alleged to have been found in the wreckage.
Pork chop hill
Pork chop hill

The MH17  Shootdown

… by  Michael Shrimpton


The victims want to be avenged. I can guarantee you that, as I can this will have again if we do not take care of business.
The victims want to be avenged. I can guarantee you that, as I can that this will have again if we do not take care of business.

[ Editor’s Note: We are obviously going to be following this fast-moving story and posting multiple articles with multiple sources and a variety of time periods to gather and analyze the material.

This is not all going to knit together into a nice simple picture, and you will see the words “provisional” and “unconfirmed” used to remind the readers that this is a work in progress.

But we do have a major tragedy crisis team of very experienced career professionals in all aspects for the event in question, from the pilots, the air to ground and air to air missiles, the radar capabilities, and what the satellites can catch.

We can already conclusively tell you that major information is being withheld by one or more major governments, so they can exploit the deaths of these murdered people for a geopolitical advantage. That is a hint as to who is behind the tragedy… and all of the others really.

As we have been reporting here consistently at VT, if the loyal people in our Intelligence and security services do not step forward to expose and hunt down all of those involved in this AND the past attacks, they will continue to happen. Based on what we have been able to learn, we know that most of the top people realize that compromised elements within various countries are running these operations… alone, or in conjunction with partners.

As long as they are left unexposed publicly, it is putting those withholding the information in an aiding-and-abetting complicity position. That this information is being classified to hide it is no longer a kosher item as protecting anyone’s national security. It is quite the opposite.

There are working elements hunting them down and who have learned a great deal that will be put to good use. Of course this will be done at great risk, as it is going to make some very powerful people very unhappy, who have the capacity to reach out and touch someone, as do others.

A large national security threat is being allowed to continue on, unaddressed, while the taxpayers spend a fortune to have all of their own communications hoovered up for storage and analysis, … such dereliction of duty would be viewed by many as treason… Jim W. Dean ]


–  First pulished July 19th, 2014  –


To paraphrase the late, great Oscar Wilde, to lose one Boeing 777  is a misfortune. To lose two starts to look like carelessness.  On July 17, at around 1415  Zulu, yet another Malaysian Airlines 777-200ER was shot down, over the eastern Ukraine. This time it was the fate of 9M-MRD, Captain Eugene Choo Jin Leong in command.

Unlike MH370 the flight was full to capacity and there were 295 souls aboard. Tragically all were lost. I give the airline another two years at best.  As with PanAm after the DVD brought down that 747 over Lockerbie it will be a slow death.

People are already cancelling flights on Malaysian, their insurance premiums will skyrocket faster than a Chinese SAM and their cashflow will go south, unlike MH370.

Among the lost, Fatima Dyczynski - CEO and Director, Xoterra Space, visionary for Nano Satellites. May all rest in peace.
Among the lost, Fatima Dyczynski – CEO and Director, Xoterra Space, visionary for Nano Satellites. May all the crew and passengers rest in peace.

At this time my provisional conclusion is that MH17 was shot down by an air defense battery of the Ukrainian army, from Ukrainian territory, using an SA-17 Buk missile.  I respectfully associate myself with the statements of the Russian federal government on the issue.

My estimate is that a 9M317 single-stage, solid fueled missile was used, in semi-active homing mode.  The 317 uses a radar proximity fuse and a direct hit can probably be ruled out.  That is to say the warhead probably detonated away from the hull, perhaps as much as 50 feet away.

That is consistent with the eyewitness evidence, which is of the plane falling from the sky more or less intact, and breaking apart on impact, and the tight debris field.  Although there was a post-crash fire most of the unfortunate victims seem to have died from negative G-forces whilst strapped into their seats.

The fact that most passengers were strapped in suggests that Captain Leong had time to warn his passengers of impending missile impact.  There is some evidence that he took evasive maneuvers, correctly diving the aircraft to increase speed and mitigate damage due to explosive decompression.

MH17’s assigned altitude, by Ukrainian air traffic control, was FL330, or 33,000 feet.  I suspect that Captain Leong or his first officer saw the incoming and, as indicated, dived, so that interception was at a lower altitude.

There is no evidence that the target fireballed at altitude, which rules out a direct hit on the fuel tanks, although we may find some shrapnel damage.

The mainstream media, who are rushing to blame Russia, or pro-Russian separatists, are showing typical aviation illiteracy, of the sort on display after MH370 was shot down. On that occasion, as regular readers of this column will recall, they did not understand that aviation fuel is light and evaporates. That basic technical deficiency led them to confuse the diesel slick from the sunk Chinese SSK with fuel from the downed airliner.

On this occasion they are reporting at one and the same time, sometimes on the same page, that the airliner was ‘blown out of the sky’ yet fell to the ground intact and broke apart on landing.  In the UK the Sun is leading the race to come up with the silliest reporting, with respect. Its front page today was asinine. Its journalistic standards are in freefall to New York Times levels.

If the stricken airliner did not fireball and had time to take evasive action, it also had time to broadcast a Mayday message.  The fact that it did not suggests that its radios were being jammed.  We will probably find that its ACARS reporting system failed as well, as with MH370.  I find it highly significant that there is a media blackout on the status on the ACARS system.

If the ACARS was disabled, or the radios were jammed, then the pro-Russian separatists can safely be ruled out, although as I explain below they can be pretty much ruled out anyway, as they lack the capability.


The SA-17

9A317 TELAR of Buk-M2E
9A317 TELAR of Buk-M2E

The SA-17, which also has a naval variant, originally entered Soviet service in 1979, but it has been developed considerably since then, indeed the latest, SA-17, versions have a different Pentagon classification.

It is fired from either a Transporter-Erector Launcher (TEL), with four missiles, or a Transport-Erector Launcher And Radar (TELAR), which I think can carry up to six missiles, depending on version. It is a highly capable system, in service with both the Russian and Ukrainian armed forces.

Some of the technology may have been transferred from the US during the Soviet period by DVD assets in Washington. The SA-17 is similar to the excellent Standard missile, indeed it is sometimes jokingly referred to as the “Standardski”.

The distinction between the TEL and the TELAR is important, because it is being said that Russian separatists captured a Buk launcher, although the evidence consists only of social media reports, a dubious source of information at best. The evidence, such as it is, is equally consistent with the Ukrainians setting the rebels up. The separatists themselves have strongly denied any high-altitude interception capability.

The Buk represented a significant improvement over the SA-6 Gainful which preceded it. There is no doubt that TELAR vehicles can both acquire and launch but significant doubt that a TEL on its own has any target acquisition capability.

So far as I can tell a TEL is basically a launch on visual confirmation of target system, i.e. pretty basic, rather like a shoulder-launched MANPAD. You see the target, point your missile in its rough direction and shoot, relying on the missile’s onboard target acquisition system (typically infra-red with MANPADs and semi-active with the Buk) to achieve lock-on, hoping another target does not get in the way.

The SA-17 is designed to be fired from a command vehicle, that is to say it is not so very different from the SA-6, where you needed three vehicles (radar, command vehicle and launcher).  There is not the slightest evidence that the separatists acquired a command vehicle, indeed there is no reliable evidence that they acquired a TELAR.  The most they might have got – and I am not buying even that – was a TEL.

If the most they have is a TEL then we can rule them out completely for a beyond visual range engagement, as happened yesterday.  Even if they had a TELAR there is no evidence that they have anyone trained on the Buk. I do not buy the argument that it can be used by your average separatist, many of them no brighter than the average journalist or MP (no offense intended), without specialist training. There are no reports at all of the separatists having fired any training rounds, i.e. if it was them they achieved a long-range kill first time they fired the weapon. Not buying.

Missile speed for the 317 version is around Mach 4, giving Captain Leong no chance at all, given that his radars were switched on and no one showed him my work on MH370.  An SA-17 warhead is typically around 70 kilos, or 154 pounds (there are different versions of the missile), enough to down a 777. It’s a big bird, around 18 feet long, weighing in at just over 1,500 pounds. It’s large enough for one of the pilots to have spotted its approach in broad daylight, given the good visibility. The solid fuel rocket engine has a burn time of around 15 seconds and leaves a highly visible exhaust trail.

The 317 has a range of about 27-28 miles. That is significant because MH17 was shot down about 25 miles from the Russian frontier. That is getting close to the limit of system capabilities for a launch from Russian territory. US intelligence sources are being quoted today as saying that the missile was fired from within the Ukraine, which makes sense to me, and is one of the reasons why I conclude, provisionally, that the Ukrainians were responsible.


Kiev Must Have Known It Was MH17

The next thing to note about the SA-17 is that it has a sophisticated phased-array fire control radar, capable of target differentiation. Assuming, as I am prepared to assume, that it was the Ukrainian army, then they must have known that it was MH17.  A freely available phone app was all they would have needed to tell them where the flight was.

The target was flying along a designated airway at a typical altitude for a civilian airliner, probably with an active transponder until it was taken down after entering Ukrainian airspace. It was not maneuvering, at least not until it saw the incoming, and could not conceivably have been confused for a military aircraft, not least as it had been directed to the kill zone by Ukrainian air traffic control.


Why MH17?

Poroshenko and Obama
Poroshenko and Obama

It seems that the motive was to discredit Russia, and that nice man President Putin in particular.  The Ukrainian attack on MH17 was obviously planned well in advance.

The preparations may have included fake entries on social media websites to the effect that the rebels had acquired an SA-17 launcher. So far as is known there were no persons of interest on board the plane, unlike MH370, save for the poor AIDS researchers.

It is wildly improbable that it is a coincidence that both shot down aircraft were Malaysian. Someone is making a point. Malaysian Airlines are being taken down.  If you have any frequent flyer miles on Malaysian use them up now, preferably on a partner airline.

The Administration has also rounded on the Russians and the rebels. Its claim that the rebels were to blame is obvious nonsense, which is unlikely to have been supported by professional intelligence officers, who would have had access to pretty much the same ELINT as the Russians.

I entirely support Moscow’s claim to be in possession of ELINT data indicating that the target was painted by Ukrainian fire control radar, probably the organic fire control radar of a Ukrainian SA-17 battery.

STSS 2011 concept - US can track it all
STSS 2011 concept – US can track it all

The total inability of the Administration to give the co-ordinates of this alleged rebel-controlled SA-17 launcher is telling.  All that President Obama could say today was that the missile was fired from within a rebel-held area.

That, with respect, is an obvious lie, since the NSA would have overheads, as well as the ELINT data.  If the attack genuinely came from a rebel-held area then you can bet your bottom dollar the Administration would be handing out the evidence.

It is likely that the attack was cleared by Kiev in advance, high up the payroll, with both Berlin and the White House.  The FAA, which is penetrated and was implicated in helping to set up the Turkish Airlines DC-10 Paris Air Disaster, seems to have helped in setting up the rebels as patsies.  The presence of only one US citizen on board carried obvious political attractions for the White House.

One must recall that the covert German DVD intelligence organisation has thoroughly penetrated the Obama Administration, at a senior level, and is in effective control of the German federal government.  It is the world’s only intelligence agency which regularly attacks commercial airliners.

The Russians have never knowingly shot down a civilian airliner on a designated airway.  I leave out of account KAL007 and the earlier KAL Boeing 707 incident, as those aircraft were well off course, were intercepted at night and had violated Soviet airspace without authorisation.

There is no reason at all to suppose that the Soviet fighter pilots thought they were attacking a Boeing 747, indeed there is no reliable evidence that KAL007 was even showing her navigation lights.  As I point out in Spyhunter there are unanswered questions about that incident.


The AIDS Conference in Melbourne Australia

The presence of so many AIDS scientists and researchers on board the flight is an obvious anomaly. It rather looks as though they added to the attraction for the DVD and Kiev – don’t forget that the Ukrainian regime is effectively a German puppet government.

I have long had my suspicions about AIDS. I am increasingly swinging towards the view that AIDS was created by the DVD as a bio-weapon. I am aware that CDC in Atlanta have their suspicions as well, indeed this column is now being read at CDC (hi guys!).

The selection of this particular flight (the Germans and Ukrainians could have chosen to shoot down a Schiphol-KL flight earlier this week or next week) tends to confirm that the DVD have an interest in hampering AIDS research.


The Dutch Connection

The Germans hate the Dutch, possibly because they are such nice people. Remember they invaded and raped Holland in 1940. The German occupation of the Netherlands was brutal. The ‘Jerries’ wasted no time in taking control again over Holland postwar, via the EEC, in 1958.

Again as revealed in Spyhunter, the DVD are implicated in at least two previous incidents of mass murder of Dutch citizens on civilian airliners, indeed the presence of so many Dutch citizens on one flight, flying over the territory of a German puppet state in a civil war with Russian backed rebels, who would be convenient patsies, was an obvious red flag.

Very frankly it should have been picked up by the excellent Dutch AIVD, indeed knowing how professional they are, it probably was. Intel warnings from the Good Guys are often blocked, not least where state bureaucracies have been penetrated by the DVD.

The first was the Tenerife Air Disaster, where a collision between an American (PanAm) and a Dutch (KLM) 747 was planned by the DVD and facilitated by a Luftwaffe ground radar unit. The second was the Tripoli Air Disaster, where the engines’ FADEC software was sabotaged.


MH - 370
MH – 370

The Failure to Follow Up the MH370 Shoot Down

Those who suppressed my warnings from the aviation community now have blood on their hands. Had poor Captain Leong known that the Bad Guys were deliberately firing long range missiles at airliners using semi-active homing he would have known better than to cruise over contested airspace with his radars turned on.

Had my advice, as given in Spyhunter and in this column after MH370 was shot down, been followed, then this tragedy would not have happened. It is upsetting to see lives thrown away in this casual manner.

At least my argument that airliners face high altitude missile threats, obvious from the time we realised that the Iranians had shot down TWA800 with a Phoenix, may now be given greater weight. Aviation security consultants have obsessed, dangerously, with MANPADS, which have a typical ceiling of only 12-15,000 feet.

It is a pity that Malaysian Airlines did not consult me after 370. Almost alone amongst aviation security experts I was alive to the high-altitude threat, indeed I am the only aviation intelligence specialist in the world to have gone public on the high altitude missile threat to airliners.

I would have advised strongly against flying through contested Ukrainian airspace. The FAA warnings and claims that the rebels had acquired a Buk would have been further red flags for me.

There it is, sadly. The airline rejected my claim that MH370 was shot down, or accepted it and participated in the cover-up, took no steps whatsoever to guard against the high altitude missile threat and have now lost another 777, 295 people and probably the airline itself into the bargain.


Response to Comments

Not too much space this week for responses, but I am grateful to Robert Powell and other commenters for their kind words.  More critics I don’t need!

Just to reassure ‘Gerry Kraut’ I am not dyslexic.  I hear what ‘Ordinary Serf’ says about Sir Jeremy Heywood, the Cabinet Secretary, or, if you prefer, de facto dictator of Britain.  And no, HRH Prince Philip is not a pedophile, nor a heroin dealer, if it comes to that. If I may say so, he is an awfully nice chap, with a wonderful sense of humor and sound views on the Chinese.

I stand by my comments on Rolf Harris, and look forward to his appeal being allowed, with heavy damages against the Met for malicious prosecution to follow.  Indeed, all the Yewtree prosecutions are malicious, having been undertaken for a collateral purpose.


Classic Movie of the Week: Pork Chop Hill (1959), dir. Lewis Milestone

This is a fine war movie, starring Gregory Peck as the hero, Lt Joe Clemons, of the 7th Infantry Division. Rip Torn and George Peppard give Peck fine support.

This is a fictionalised account of a real battle, in the Korean War, controversial in the States because of the casualties and the limited gains made on the ground by UN forces.  The New York Times loved the movie, partly because they drew the wrong conclusions from it.  The whole point of the action (in fact there were several battles), as the great Major-General Trudeau of the 7th understood, was symbolic.

The important thing is that the Chinese lost a great many more casualties than the Good Guys.  The portrayal of the insolent Chinese negotiators at Panmunjeom has the ring of the truth.  The message of the movie – that the best way to negotiate with Chinese communists is to bayonet a few of the bastards – holds true to the present day.

General Trudeau was in Army intelligence and became the director of army intelligence not long afterwards. He was obviously good because the DVD’s Allen Welsh Dulles forced him out, based on a dodgy dossier. The contents of the dossier have never been declassified, but we know it was dodgy, because it came from Dulles. A classic evil scumbag (no offense) A. W. never acted in good faith if he could avoid it.

The real lesson of the movie of course is that you should never let the enemy occupy the White House. With ‘von’ Eisenhower in charge the Korean War was always going to end in a messy compromise, condemning the people of the north to decades of brutal dictatorship and slavery. The sensible strategic choice was to declare war on China and bomb Peking flat as a poppadom.



Michael Shrimpton is a barrister, called to the Bar in London 1983. He is a specialist in National Security and Constitutional Law, Strategic Intelligence and Counterterrorism.

Michael was formerly an Adjunct Professor of Intelligence Studies in what was then the Department of National Security, Intelligence and Space Studies at the American Military University.

Michael’s ground-breaking, 700 page intelligence text “Spyhunter: The Secret History of German Intelligence” was published in England by June Press on April 14th 2014.


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Michael Shrimpton

Michael Shrimpton is a barrister, currently suspended of course, called to the Bar in London in 1983. He is a specialist in National Security and Constitutional Law, Strategic Intelligence and Counter-terrorism.

He has wide ranging connections both in Western Intelligence agencies and amongst ex-Soviet Bloc agencies. The late Generaloberst Markus Wolf, of the Stasi and DVD, was one of his contacts. Michael has earned respect in the intelligence community for his analysis of previously unacknowledged post-WWII covert operations against the West by the German DVD organization based in Dachau, near Munich, Germany, and its British, French and American client agencies.

These continue to the present day, as politicians and the media are too nervous of standing up to them.

Michael was formerly an Adjunct Professor of Intelligence Studies in the Department of National Security, Intelligence and Space Studies at the American Military University, teaching intelligence subjects at Masters level to inter alia serving intelligence officers. He has represented US and Israeli intelligence officers in law and briefed in staffers on the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence and the Joint Congressional Inquiry into 9-11.

In the wake of that murderous attack he addressed panels on terrorism in Washington DC and Los Angeles organized by the respected Jewish Institute for National Security Affairs. Fellow panelists included a former head of Special Operations Command and a former Commander of the US Atlantic Fleet.

Michael's active assistance to Intelligence and Law Enforcement agencies in the Global War on Terror produced some notable successes, including the exposure of the Abu Ghraib 'hood' photograph as a fake.

His work on strategic intelligence took him to the Pentagon and he has also met with senior advisors to the President of the Russian Federation, in Moscow, in November 2005. He participated in the Global Strategic Review conference in Geneva in 2005 and was a speaker at both the Intelligence Conference (Intelcon) in 2005, and the Intelligence Summit in 2006, each at Crystal City.

In 2006 he was flown out to, and flew off from, the nuclear-powered aircraft carrier USS Enterprise (CVN-65), as part of the US Navy's Distinguished Visitor Program. She was then working up her air group off the Eastern Seaboard of the United States, before operational deployment to the Persian Gulf. It is comparatively unusual for a foreign civilian to complete a carrier landing and launch cycle.

Michael's ground-breaking, 700 page intelligence text "Spyhunter: The Secret History of German Intelligence" was published in England by June Press in April 2014. It features on a number of intelligence syllabuses, as does intelligence analysis prepared by Michael, e.g. on the brutal 2003 assassination of British weapons scientist Dr David Kelly CMG.

In their unlawful raid on Michael’s home in Wendover, Buckinghamshire in April 2012 Thames Valley Police officers seized the manuscript of Spyhunter and all of Michael’s onshore backups. Publication was only possible because the draft had been backed up offshore. The police hung onto the seized copies long after it was decided not to use them as evidence.

In November 2014 Michael was convicted at Southwark Crown Court by a tampered-with jury panel on two bogus bomb-hoax charges. Prior to bringing in the police the British Ministry of Defence, after consulting with the Cabinet Office, destroyed their recordings of Michael’s initial contact and qualified intelligence briefing re a DVD operation to target the Opening Ceremony of the 2012 Olympics using a stolen Russian SS-N-19 warhead.

Happily the NSA intercepted both Michael’s call to MOD and their call to him (on a number he had provided) and the intercepts are now in the hands of MI5.

As Michael’s distinguished Veterans Today colleagues Gordon Duff and Ben Fulford have confirmed on this website, his intelligence briefing to MOD was substantially correct and two warheads, both off an SS-19, were recovered by the US. After inspection the Department of Energy estimated their yield at 20KT.

Comments Closed


  1. from a hideously sexualised Barbie doll

    ‘Pork chop hill’

    we give thanks to the editors and Michael Shrimpton

    albeit with a bit of head scratching.

    C’est la vie

    with Love xx

  2. COBRA are meeting to discuss emergency cautionary plans, agains ther new magic ebola break out !

    They still havnt found anyone with the guts to take on the paedo scandal, however, and seem to be thinking that it might go away, if they pay enough attention to ebola on africa !

  3. PS – THERESA MAY (Dear Theresa May, who has helped bring in a law, that british police can be disciplined for FAILING TO BE POLITE TO MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC), please do the right thing, once again, by asking BRIAN GERRISH (of ukcolumn,org), to be part of the panel, for the paedo investigation.

    Preferably BILL MALLONEY, as well – but if you can’t bring yourself to have him on, then at the very least BRIAN GERRISH (as an ex intelligence officer, for the British Military), is a must, if you want to bring yourself back to the front of British MP’s, who are determined to make this country right, again.

    Employing Ken Clarke, just wont do.

    Employing a Jimmy Saville Character, just wont do.

    ALL that will do, is someone who has already stuck their neck out to prove they are on the voters side, NOT the paedo’s side.

    With respect, it does appear at the moment, that you are trying to take part in the cover up – personally, i am sure you were stitched up. I cannot equate that you would cover up for paedos. Therefore, you have been abuse, pressured, arm twisted.

    but we the people are on your side, fi you can just pluck up this last bit (LOT) of courage, and face the paedos, head on.

    Theresa May for PM, if she can brave up to this – PM for life, i say !

    And if not, then at least you did well as an MP, in fighting polcie. I suppose you just wernet man enough, when psh came to chove.

  4. Dear MR Shrimpers, could you please, in newxt week’s (sorry, i mean last weeks) article, when it comes out, make a comment on Geoffrey Dickens ?

    He DID make the Thatcher govt aware of paedo problems, in a report which KENETH (just resigne damid the paedo scandal) CLARKE rubbished (before he was ousted amid said paedo scandal), said was undreliable, because it came from Geoffrey Dickens.

    Geoffrey Dickens, for those of you who dont know, was an MP who died very young, not long after TRYING to expose a chld murdering paedo rapist ring, operatin from NUMBER 10 DOWNING STREET.

    This was when Jimmy Saville and the like, were running all over the pace, murdering children.

    Im just saying – you’re always hot about maggie thatcher, but apperently, she knew all about it.

    So PLEASE , Mr S – you are very quick to point the finger at Obama, and defend the russians against his lies (which is braver than i might be, if i were in your position).

    So how, given the evidence against thatcher and her alleged paedo husband, are you unable to oust them, too?

    Ted Heath was a paedo , murdering German spy, i get that.

    But WHY can’t you mention the paedo murderers, who WERNET german spies ?

    Is there a protection racket going on, whereby you can only point the fingers at child killers, if they were german spies ?

    You have NEVER, to my knowledge pointed at anyone and said “he was a paedo politician,

    • (who was on our side, and was NOT a german spy).

      ps – thanks for choosing some more affordable videos ! (dont worry if you have to suceed to more expensive ones in future – it was nice just to see you take the time to find “pork chop hill”, instead of one of the more expensive options that you normally choose). It shows that you do actually take the time to listen to your fans, and to read our comments (which again, is braver than i might be – and very thoughtful – unless of course pork chop hill was just a cheapo, that snuck in, without prior planning – i realise you cant clarify everything we ask – therefore, just the Ken Clarke thing would be more than enough).

      Thanks (presuming you read this)

  5. Breaking from Duff here at VT, looks like the Russians have now released video of the missile launch. Looks like Mr. S called it right.
    (Note: The Video is only published on VT and was released by the Russian government directly to Duff alone. Were our commenter who is often troll-like and off topic to be honest, he or she might not have made the comment at all. The blackbox information backs the Duff assertion as the missile damage could not have brought down the plane as indicated.|

  6. Nancy Bisset, with her Facebook comments above, kept asking about the Barbie doll image. That image would have been chosen by the editors, not Mr. Shrimpton.

    • Agree on this one JS, I pointed the same thing out to ‘mikeward’ further down this page. It is a surprising image to put up (not one I would have chosen), but editors are working under a lot of pressure on this site and, with all due respect to Nancy, there are much more important things that need to be focused on here.

    • Actually, ive done a quick googly thing, and it appears the photo is/might be an actual photo, from the scene.

      Therefore, said “new graphic designer” might just not have noticed the obvious link with the photo below it. Picture Bill and Ted, and they’ve just got jobs making the pages stand out, at VT.

      I think thats what graphic designers are like,

  7. Michael, as of Friday evening UK time , nobody is answering this one either ie. writers or commenters)

    From article ‘NEO – Cold Case…MH17 faint echos of KAL007 Shootdown’ – 23/07/14

    ‘……The passports of the doctors have been recovered. They were [according to mainstream media] not in the clothing of their bodies but in a separate box, all together.

    If there is some sort of procedure for collecting the passports of a particular group of passengers during flight and putting them together in a separate box, it must be buried very deep in the Malaysian Airlines manual……But it does conveniently show, in the event of a fatal crash, that not just one but a whole group of doctors died together in the line of duty, and advances the narrative well….’

    (From me – comments section)

    ‘….Do we know the actual number of doctors’ passports that were recovered and that they were definitely all doctors? Or were they delegates to the conference, some of whom were doctors?

    As with Michael Shrimpton’s article which flagged up the significance of this AIDS conference, I am still trying to reconcile the statements here with the press statements from the conference itself, which repeat that 6 delegates were lost on MH17 (and names them) out of 12,000 delegates in Melbourne. Are we saying that there were many more than that and the press statements coming out of Melbourne are deliberately false / simply mistaken?’

    Any further thoughts on this one? Serf.

    • Serf, everything about this MH17 crash is crazy. So maybe the 6 AIDS people were NOT on that plane, but are all alive somewhere, working on a secret project? Since so much else is faked, and family not allowed anywhere near the bodies, identification of bodies will be difficult. DNA tests can be faked.

      And what is up with that military exercise in the area, Rapid Trident?

    • Re your post to me further down JS, I am not discounting the Aids connection out of hand, which is why I was careful to say ‘at present’ in my comments below. I am (for all practical purposes) discounting the figure of 100 quoted in the Guardian as being the possible number of delegates on that plane. I did point out on the Dennis / Jim article in the last day or so, that Dr. Lange was highly significant in the field of Aids research. Who knows ? Maybe he was going to blow the lid on a DVD connection that Mr S hints at in his article and they needed to take him out – speculation again.

    • As I see it, (with apologies if I am misinterpreting writers’ positions on here) we have the following

      Gordon – look at Israeli security influence at Schiphol and that there was likely a bomb on that plane.
      Dennis / Jim / Harold – look at the possibility that the plane didn’t even leave the airport (cancelled) and that this is a hoax with possible MH370 connections.
      Michael (initial analysis which I am sure will be updated when he is ready) – plane could have come down from a missile, much more likely fired from within the Ukraine as it is stretching the limits for it to have come from inside Russian borders.

      So I think at present

      It ain’t the Russians (absolutely no way). The Russians know exactly what happened and so do the Americans. The telling thing is this Rapid Trident exercise – stinks to high heaven of a drill / exercise covering a false flag. MH370 connection ? Possibly, but I am really waiting to see if Mr S is willing to move in the direction that there are other possibilities other than a Chinese shootdown.

      America is going down rapidly and the Dennis / Jim article yesterday, when combined with Gordon’s article about nukes in the US and the power grid (14th July) are everything that is happening (Gaza / Ukraine) is connected and we are heading for a really huge event in the not too distant future, of which all this is the precursor.

Comments are closed.