The MH17 Shoot Down over Ukraine

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Baby doll alleged to have been found in the wreckage.

Pork chop hill
Pork chop hill

The MH17  Shootdown

… by  Michael Shrimpton

 

The victims want to be avenged. I can guarantee you that, as I can this will have again if we do not take care of business.
The victims want to be avenged. I can guarantee you that, as I can that this will have again if we do not take care of business.

[ Editor’s Note: We are obviously going to be following this fast-moving story and posting multiple articles with multiple sources and a variety of time periods to gather and analyze the material.

This is not all going to knit together into a nice simple picture, and you will see the words “provisional” and “unconfirmed” used to remind the readers that this is a work in progress.

But we do have a major tragedy crisis team of very experienced career professionals in all aspects for the event in question, from the pilots, the air to ground and air to air missiles, the radar capabilities, and what the satellites can catch.

We can already conclusively tell you that major information is being withheld by one or more major governments, so they can exploit the deaths of these murdered people for a geopolitical advantage. That is a hint as to who is behind the tragedy… and all of the others really.

As we have been reporting here consistently at VT, if the loyal people in our Intelligence and security services do not step forward to expose and hunt down all of those involved in this AND the past attacks, they will continue to happen. Based on what we have been able to learn, we know that most of the top people realize that compromised elements within various countries are running these operations… alone, or in conjunction with partners.

As long as they are left unexposed publicly, it is putting those withholding the information in an aiding-and-abetting complicity position. That this information is being classified to hide it is no longer a kosher item as protecting anyone’s national security. It is quite the opposite.

There are working elements hunting them down and who have learned a great deal that will be put to good use. Of course this will be done at great risk, as it is going to make some very powerful people very unhappy, who have the capacity to reach out and touch someone, as do others.

A large national security threat is being allowed to continue on, unaddressed, while the taxpayers spend a fortune to have all of their own communications hoovered up for storage and analysis, … such dereliction of duty would be viewed by many as treason… Jim W. Dean ]

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–  First pulished July 19th, 2014  –

 

To paraphrase the late, great Oscar Wilde, to lose one Boeing 777  is a misfortune. To lose two starts to look like carelessness.  On July 17, at around 1415  Zulu, yet another Malaysian Airlines 777-200ER was shot down, over the eastern Ukraine. This time it was the fate of 9M-MRD, Captain Eugene Choo Jin Leong in command.

Unlike MH370 the flight was full to capacity and there were 295 souls aboard. Tragically all were lost. I give the airline another two years at best.  As with PanAm after the DVD brought down that 747 over Lockerbie it will be a slow death.

People are already cancelling flights on Malaysian, their insurance premiums will skyrocket faster than a Chinese SAM and their cashflow will go south, unlike MH370.

Among the lost, Fatima Dyczynski - CEO and Director, Xoterra Space, visionary for Nano Satellites. May all rest in peace.
Among the lost, Fatima Dyczynski – CEO and Director, Xoterra Space, visionary for Nano Satellites. May all the crew and passengers rest in peace.

At this time my provisional conclusion is that MH17 was shot down by an air defense battery of the Ukrainian army, from Ukrainian territory, using an SA-17 Buk missile.  I respectfully associate myself with the statements of the Russian federal government on the issue.

My estimate is that a 9M317 single-stage, solid fueled missile was used, in semi-active homing mode.  The 317 uses a radar proximity fuse and a direct hit can probably be ruled out.  That is to say the warhead probably detonated away from the hull, perhaps as much as 50 feet away.

That is consistent with the eyewitness evidence, which is of the plane falling from the sky more or less intact, and breaking apart on impact, and the tight debris field.  Although there was a post-crash fire most of the unfortunate victims seem to have died from negative G-forces whilst strapped into their seats.

The fact that most passengers were strapped in suggests that Captain Leong had time to warn his passengers of impending missile impact.  There is some evidence that he took evasive maneuvers, correctly diving the aircraft to increase speed and mitigate damage due to explosive decompression.

MH17’s assigned altitude, by Ukrainian air traffic control, was FL330, or 33,000 feet.  I suspect that Captain Leong or his first officer saw the incoming and, as indicated, dived, so that interception was at a lower altitude.

There is no evidence that the target fireballed at altitude, which rules out a direct hit on the fuel tanks, although we may find some shrapnel damage.

The mainstream media, who are rushing to blame Russia, or pro-Russian separatists, are showing typical aviation illiteracy, of the sort on display after MH370 was shot down. On that occasion, as regular readers of this column will recall, they did not understand that aviation fuel is light and evaporates. That basic technical deficiency led them to confuse the diesel slick from the sunk Chinese SSK with fuel from the downed airliner.

On this occasion they are reporting at one and the same time, sometimes on the same page, that the airliner was ‘blown out of the sky’ yet fell to the ground intact and broke apart on landing.  In the UK the Sun is leading the race to come up with the silliest reporting, with respect. Its front page today was asinine. Its journalistic standards are in freefall to New York Times levels.

If the stricken airliner did not fireball and had time to take evasive action, it also had time to broadcast a Mayday message.  The fact that it did not suggests that its radios were being jammed.  We will probably find that its ACARS reporting system failed as well, as with MH370.  I find it highly significant that there is a media blackout on the status on the ACARS system.

If the ACARS was disabled, or the radios were jammed, then the pro-Russian separatists can safely be ruled out, although as I explain below they can be pretty much ruled out anyway, as they lack the capability.

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The SA-17

9A317 TELAR of Buk-M2E
9A317 TELAR of Buk-M2E

The SA-17, which also has a naval variant, originally entered Soviet service in 1979, but it has been developed considerably since then, indeed the latest, SA-17, versions have a different Pentagon classification.

It is fired from either a Transporter-Erector Launcher (TEL), with four missiles, or a Transport-Erector Launcher And Radar (TELAR), which I think can carry up to six missiles, depending on version. It is a highly capable system, in service with both the Russian and Ukrainian armed forces.

Some of the technology may have been transferred from the US during the Soviet period by DVD assets in Washington. The SA-17 is similar to the excellent Standard missile, indeed it is sometimes jokingly referred to as the “Standardski”.

The distinction between the TEL and the TELAR is important, because it is being said that Russian separatists captured a Buk launcher, although the evidence consists only of social media reports, a dubious source of information at best. The evidence, such as it is, is equally consistent with the Ukrainians setting the rebels up. The separatists themselves have strongly denied any high-altitude interception capability.

The Buk represented a significant improvement over the SA-6 Gainful which preceded it. There is no doubt that TELAR vehicles can both acquire and launch but significant doubt that a TEL on its own has any target acquisition capability.

So far as I can tell a TEL is basically a launch on visual confirmation of target system, i.e. pretty basic, rather like a shoulder-launched MANPAD. You see the target, point your missile in its rough direction and shoot, relying on the missile’s onboard target acquisition system (typically infra-red with MANPADs and semi-active with the Buk) to achieve lock-on, hoping another target does not get in the way.

The SA-17 is designed to be fired from a command vehicle, that is to say it is not so very different from the SA-6, where you needed three vehicles (radar, command vehicle and launcher).  There is not the slightest evidence that the separatists acquired a command vehicle, indeed there is no reliable evidence that they acquired a TELAR.  The most they might have got – and I am not buying even that – was a TEL.

If the most they have is a TEL then we can rule them out completely for a beyond visual range engagement, as happened yesterday.  Even if they had a TELAR there is no evidence that they have anyone trained on the Buk. I do not buy the argument that it can be used by your average separatist, many of them no brighter than the average journalist or MP (no offense intended), without specialist training. There are no reports at all of the separatists having fired any training rounds, i.e. if it was them they achieved a long-range kill first time they fired the weapon. Not buying.

Missile speed for the 317 version is around Mach 4, giving Captain Leong no chance at all, given that his radars were switched on and no one showed him my work on MH370.  An SA-17 warhead is typically around 70 kilos, or 154 pounds (there are different versions of the missile), enough to down a 777. It’s a big bird, around 18 feet long, weighing in at just over 1,500 pounds. It’s large enough for one of the pilots to have spotted its approach in broad daylight, given the good visibility. The solid fuel rocket engine has a burn time of around 15 seconds and leaves a highly visible exhaust trail.

The 317 has a range of about 27-28 miles. That is significant because MH17 was shot down about 25 miles from the Russian frontier. That is getting close to the limit of system capabilities for a launch from Russian territory. US intelligence sources are being quoted today as saying that the missile was fired from within the Ukraine, which makes sense to me, and is one of the reasons why I conclude, provisionally, that the Ukrainians were responsible.

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Kiev Must Have Known It Was MH17

The next thing to note about the SA-17 is that it has a sophisticated phased-array fire control radar, capable of target differentiation. Assuming, as I am prepared to assume, that it was the Ukrainian army, then they must have known that it was MH17.  A freely available phone app was all they would have needed to tell them where the flight was.

The target was flying along a designated airway at a typical altitude for a civilian airliner, probably with an active transponder until it was taken down after entering Ukrainian airspace. It was not maneuvering, at least not until it saw the incoming, and could not conceivably have been confused for a military aircraft, not least as it had been directed to the kill zone by Ukrainian air traffic control.

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Why MH17?

Poroshenko and Obama
Poroshenko and Obama

It seems that the motive was to discredit Russia, and that nice man President Putin in particular.  The Ukrainian attack on MH17 was obviously planned well in advance.

The preparations may have included fake entries on social media websites to the effect that the rebels had acquired an SA-17 launcher. So far as is known there were no persons of interest on board the plane, unlike MH370, save for the poor AIDS researchers.

It is wildly improbable that it is a coincidence that both shot down aircraft were Malaysian. Someone is making a point. Malaysian Airlines are being taken down.  If you have any frequent flyer miles on Malaysian use them up now, preferably on a partner airline.

The Administration has also rounded on the Russians and the rebels. Its claim that the rebels were to blame is obvious nonsense, which is unlikely to have been supported by professional intelligence officers, who would have had access to pretty much the same ELINT as the Russians.

I entirely support Moscow’s claim to be in possession of ELINT data indicating that the target was painted by Ukrainian fire control radar, probably the organic fire control radar of a Ukrainian SA-17 battery.

STSS 2011 concept - US can track it all
STSS 2011 concept – US can track it all

The total inability of the Administration to give the co-ordinates of this alleged rebel-controlled SA-17 launcher is telling.  All that President Obama could say today was that the missile was fired from within a rebel-held area.

That, with respect, is an obvious lie, since the NSA would have overheads, as well as the ELINT data.  If the attack genuinely came from a rebel-held area then you can bet your bottom dollar the Administration would be handing out the evidence.

It is likely that the attack was cleared by Kiev in advance, high up the payroll, with both Berlin and the White House.  The FAA, which is penetrated and was implicated in helping to set up the Turkish Airlines DC-10 Paris Air Disaster, seems to have helped in setting up the rebels as patsies.  The presence of only one US citizen on board carried obvious political attractions for the White House.

One must recall that the covert German DVD intelligence organisation has thoroughly penetrated the Obama Administration, at a senior level, and is in effective control of the German federal government.  It is the world’s only intelligence agency which regularly attacks commercial airliners.

The Russians have never knowingly shot down a civilian airliner on a designated airway.  I leave out of account KAL007 and the earlier KAL Boeing 707 incident, as those aircraft were well off course, were intercepted at night and had violated Soviet airspace without authorisation.

There is no reason at all to suppose that the Soviet fighter pilots thought they were attacking a Boeing 747, indeed there is no reliable evidence that KAL007 was even showing her navigation lights.  As I point out in Spyhunter there are unanswered questions about that incident.

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The AIDS Conference in Melbourne Australia

The presence of so many AIDS scientists and researchers on board the flight is an obvious anomaly. It rather looks as though they added to the attraction for the DVD and Kiev – don’t forget that the Ukrainian regime is effectively a German puppet government.

I have long had my suspicions about AIDS. I am increasingly swinging towards the view that AIDS was created by the DVD as a bio-weapon. I am aware that CDC in Atlanta have their suspicions as well, indeed this column is now being read at CDC (hi guys!).

The selection of this particular flight (the Germans and Ukrainians could have chosen to shoot down a Schiphol-KL flight earlier this week or next week) tends to confirm that the DVD have an interest in hampering AIDS research.

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The Dutch Connection

The Germans hate the Dutch, possibly because they are such nice people. Remember they invaded and raped Holland in 1940. The German occupation of the Netherlands was brutal. The ‘Jerries’ wasted no time in taking control again over Holland postwar, via the EEC, in 1958.

Again as revealed in Spyhunter, the DVD are implicated in at least two previous incidents of mass murder of Dutch citizens on civilian airliners, indeed the presence of so many Dutch citizens on one flight, flying over the territory of a German puppet state in a civil war with Russian backed rebels, who would be convenient patsies, was an obvious red flag.

Very frankly it should have been picked up by the excellent Dutch AIVD, indeed knowing how professional they are, it probably was. Intel warnings from the Good Guys are often blocked, not least where state bureaucracies have been penetrated by the DVD.

The first was the Tenerife Air Disaster, where a collision between an American (PanAm) and a Dutch (KLM) 747 was planned by the DVD and facilitated by a Luftwaffe ground radar unit. The second was the Tripoli Air Disaster, where the engines’ FADEC software was sabotaged.

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MH - 370
MH – 370

The Failure to Follow Up the MH370 Shoot Down

Those who suppressed my warnings from the aviation community now have blood on their hands. Had poor Captain Leong known that the Bad Guys were deliberately firing long range missiles at airliners using semi-active homing he would have known better than to cruise over contested airspace with his radars turned on.

Had my advice, as given in Spyhunter and in this column after MH370 was shot down, been followed, then this tragedy would not have happened. It is upsetting to see lives thrown away in this casual manner.

At least my argument that airliners face high altitude missile threats, obvious from the time we realised that the Iranians had shot down TWA800 with a Phoenix, may now be given greater weight. Aviation security consultants have obsessed, dangerously, with MANPADS, which have a typical ceiling of only 12-15,000 feet.

It is a pity that Malaysian Airlines did not consult me after 370. Almost alone amongst aviation security experts I was alive to the high-altitude threat, indeed I am the only aviation intelligence specialist in the world to have gone public on the high altitude missile threat to airliners.

I would have advised strongly against flying through contested Ukrainian airspace. The FAA warnings and claims that the rebels had acquired a Buk would have been further red flags for me.

There it is, sadly. The airline rejected my claim that MH370 was shot down, or accepted it and participated in the cover-up, took no steps whatsoever to guard against the high altitude missile threat and have now lost another 777, 295 people and probably the airline itself into the bargain.

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Response to Comments

Not too much space this week for responses, but I am grateful to Robert Powell and other commenters for their kind words.  More critics I don’t need!

Just to reassure ‘Gerry Kraut’ I am not dyslexic.  I hear what ‘Ordinary Serf’ says about Sir Jeremy Heywood, the Cabinet Secretary, or, if you prefer, de facto dictator of Britain.  And no, HRH Prince Philip is not a pedophile, nor a heroin dealer, if it comes to that. If I may say so, he is an awfully nice chap, with a wonderful sense of humor and sound views on the Chinese.

I stand by my comments on Rolf Harris, and look forward to his appeal being allowed, with heavy damages against the Met for malicious prosecution to follow.  Indeed, all the Yewtree prosecutions are malicious, having been undertaken for a collateral purpose.

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Classic Movie of the Week: Pork Chop Hill (1959), dir. Lewis Milestone

This is a fine war movie, starring Gregory Peck as the hero, Lt Joe Clemons, of the 7th Infantry Division. Rip Torn and George Peppard give Peck fine support.

This is a fictionalised account of a real battle, in the Korean War, controversial in the States because of the casualties and the limited gains made on the ground by UN forces.  The New York Times loved the movie, partly because they drew the wrong conclusions from it.  The whole point of the action (in fact there were several battles), as the great Major-General Trudeau of the 7th understood, was symbolic.

The important thing is that the Chinese lost a great many more casualties than the Good Guys.  The portrayal of the insolent Chinese negotiators at Panmunjeom has the ring of the truth.  The message of the movie – that the best way to negotiate with Chinese communists is to bayonet a few of the bastards – holds true to the present day.

General Trudeau was in Army intelligence and became the director of army intelligence not long afterwards. He was obviously good because the DVD’s Allen Welsh Dulles forced him out, based on a dodgy dossier. The contents of the dossier have never been declassified, but we know it was dodgy, because it came from Dulles. A classic evil scumbag (no offense) A. W. never acted in good faith if he could avoid it.

The real lesson of the movie of course is that you should never let the enemy occupy the White House. With ‘von’ Eisenhower in charge the Korean War was always going to end in a messy compromise, condemning the people of the north to decades of brutal dictatorship and slavery. The sensible strategic choice was to declare war on China and bomb Peking flat as a poppadom.

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Spyhunter
Spyhunter

Michael Shrimpton is a barrister, called to the Bar in London 1983. He is a specialist in National Security and Constitutional Law, Strategic Intelligence and Counterterrorism.

Michael was formerly an Adjunct Professor of Intelligence Studies in what was then the Department of National Security, Intelligence and Space Studies at the American Military University.

Michael’s ground-breaking, 700 page intelligence text “Spyhunter: The Secret History of German Intelligence” was published in England by June Press on April 14th 2014.

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Michael Shrimpton

Michael Shrimpton is a barrister, currently suspended of course, called to the Bar in London in 1983. He is a specialist in National Security and Constitutional Law, Strategic Intelligence and Counter-terrorism.

He has wide ranging connections both in Western Intelligence agencies and amongst ex-Soviet Bloc agencies. The late Generaloberst Markus Wolf, of the Stasi and DVD, was one of his contacts. Michael has earned respect in the intelligence community for his analysis of previously unacknowledged post-WWII covert operations against the West by the German DVD organization based in Dachau, near Munich, Germany, and its British, French and American client agencies.

These continue to the present day, as politicians and the media are too nervous of standing up to them.

Michael was formerly an Adjunct Professor of Intelligence Studies in the Department of National Security, Intelligence and Space Studies at the American Military University, teaching intelligence subjects at Masters level to inter alia serving intelligence officers. He has represented US and Israeli intelligence officers in law and briefed in staffers on the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence and the Joint Congressional Inquiry into 9-11.

In the wake of that murderous attack he addressed panels on terrorism in Washington DC and Los Angeles organized by the respected Jewish Institute for National Security Affairs. Fellow panelists included a former head of Special Operations Command and a former Commander of the US Atlantic Fleet.

Michael's active assistance to Intelligence and Law Enforcement agencies in the Global War on Terror produced some notable successes, including the exposure of the Abu Ghraib 'hood' photograph as a fake.

His work on strategic intelligence took him to the Pentagon and he has also met with senior advisors to the President of the Russian Federation, in Moscow, in November 2005. He participated in the Global Strategic Review conference in Geneva in 2005 and was a speaker at both the Intelligence Conference (Intelcon) in 2005, and the Intelligence Summit in 2006, each at Crystal City.

In 2006 he was flown out to, and flew off from, the nuclear-powered aircraft carrier USS Enterprise (CVN-65), as part of the US Navy's Distinguished Visitor Program. She was then working up her air group off the Eastern Seaboard of the United States, before operational deployment to the Persian Gulf. It is comparatively unusual for a foreign civilian to complete a carrier landing and launch cycle.

Michael's ground-breaking, 700 page intelligence text "Spyhunter: The Secret History of German Intelligence" was published in England by June Press in April 2014. It features on a number of intelligence syllabuses, as does intelligence analysis prepared by Michael, e.g. on the brutal 2003 assassination of British weapons scientist Dr David Kelly CMG.

In their unlawful raid on Michael’s home in Wendover, Buckinghamshire in April 2012 Thames Valley Police officers seized the manuscript of Spyhunter and all of Michael’s onshore backups. Publication was only possible because the draft had been backed up offshore. The police hung onto the seized copies long after it was decided not to use them as evidence.

In November 2014 Michael was convicted at Southwark Crown Court by a tampered-with jury panel on two bogus bomb-hoax charges. Prior to bringing in the police the British Ministry of Defence, after consulting with the Cabinet Office, destroyed their recordings of Michael’s initial contact and qualified intelligence briefing re a DVD operation to target the Opening Ceremony of the 2012 Olympics using a stolen Russian SS-N-19 warhead.

Happily the NSA intercepted both Michael’s call to MOD and their call to him (on a number he had provided) and the intercepts are now in the hands of MI5.

As Michael’s distinguished Veterans Today colleagues Gordon Duff and Ben Fulford have confirmed on this website, his intelligence briefing to MOD was substantially correct and two warheads, both off an SS-19, were recovered by the US. After inspection the Department of Energy estimated their yield at 20KT.

102 COMMENTS

  1. from a hideously sexualised Barbie doll
    to

    ‘Pork chop hill’

    we give thanks to the editors and Michael Shrimpton

    albeit with a bit of head scratching.

    C’est la vie

    with Love xx

  2. COBRA are meeting to discuss emergency cautionary plans, agains ther new magic ebola break out !

    They still havnt found anyone with the guts to take on the paedo scandal, however, and seem to be thinking that it might go away, if they pay enough attention to ebola on africa !

  3. PS – THERESA MAY (Dear Theresa May, who has helped bring in a law, that british police can be disciplined for FAILING TO BE POLITE TO MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC), please do the right thing, once again, by asking BRIAN GERRISH (of ukcolumn,org), to be part of the panel, for the paedo investigation.

    Preferably BILL MALLONEY, as well – but if you can’t bring yourself to have him on, then at the very least BRIAN GERRISH (as an ex intelligence officer, for the British Military), is a must, if you want to bring yourself back to the front of British MP’s, who are determined to make this country right, again.

    Employing Ken Clarke, just wont do.

    Employing a Jimmy Saville Character, just wont do.

    ALL that will do, is someone who has already stuck their neck out to prove they are on the voters side, NOT the paedo’s side.

    With respect, it does appear at the moment, that you are trying to take part in the cover up – personally, i am sure you were stitched up. I cannot equate that you would cover up for paedos. Therefore, you have been abuse, pressured, arm twisted.

    but we the people are on your side, fi you can just pluck up this last bit (LOT) of courage, and face the paedos, head on.

    Theresa May for PM, if she can brave up to this – PM for life, i say !

    And if not, then at least you did well as an MP, in fighting polcie. I suppose you just wernet man enough, when psh came to chove.

  4. Dear MR Shrimpers, could you please, in newxt week’s (sorry, i mean last weeks) article, when it comes out, make a comment on Geoffrey Dickens ?

    He DID make the Thatcher govt aware of paedo problems, in a report which KENETH (just resigne damid the paedo scandal) CLARKE rubbished (before he was ousted amid said paedo scandal), said was undreliable, because it came from Geoffrey Dickens.

    Geoffrey Dickens, for those of you who dont know, was an MP who died very young, not long after TRYING to expose a chld murdering paedo rapist ring, operatin from NUMBER 10 DOWNING STREET.

    This was when Jimmy Saville and the like, were running all over the pace, murdering children.

    Im just saying – you’re always hot about maggie thatcher, but apperently, she knew all about it.

    So PLEASE , Mr S – you are very quick to point the finger at Obama, and defend the russians against his lies (which is braver than i might be, if i were in your position).

    So how, given the evidence against thatcher and her alleged paedo husband, are you unable to oust them, too?

    Ted Heath was a paedo , murdering German spy, i get that.

    But WHY can’t you mention the paedo murderers, who WERNET german spies ?

    Is there a protection racket going on, whereby you can only point the fingers at child killers, if they were german spies ?

    You have NEVER, to my knowledge pointed at anyone and said “he was a paedo politician,

    • (who was on our side, and was NOT a german spy).

      ps – thanks for choosing some more affordable videos ! (dont worry if you have to suceed to more expensive ones in future – it was nice just to see you take the time to find “pork chop hill”, instead of one of the more expensive options that you normally choose). It shows that you do actually take the time to listen to your fans, and to read our comments (which again, is braver than i might be – and very thoughtful – unless of course pork chop hill was just a cheapo, that snuck in, without prior planning – i realise you cant clarify everything we ask – therefore, just the Ken Clarke thing would be more than enough).

      Thanks (presuming you read this)

  5. Breaking from Duff here at VT, looks like the Russians have now released video of the missile launch. Looks like Mr. S called it right.
    http://www.veteranstoday.com/2014/07/27/notes-on-mh17/
    (Note: The Video is only published on VT and was released by the Russian government directly to Duff alone. Were our commenter who is often troll-like and off topic to be honest, he or she might not have made the comment at all. The blackbox information backs the Duff assertion as the missile damage could not have brought down the plane as indicated.|

  6. Nancy Bisset, with her Facebook comments above, kept asking about the Barbie doll image. That image would have been chosen by the editors, not Mr. Shrimpton.

    • Agree on this one JS, I pointed the same thing out to ‘mikeward’ further down this page. It is a surprising image to put up (not one I would have chosen), but editors are working under a lot of pressure on this site and, with all due respect to Nancy, there are much more important things that need to be focused on here.

    • Actually, ive done a quick googly thing, and it appears the photo is/might be an actual photo, from the scene.

      Therefore, said “new graphic designer” might just not have noticed the obvious link with the photo below it. Picture Bill and Ted, and they’ve just got jobs making the pages stand out, at VT.

      I think thats what graphic designers are like,

  7. Michael, as of Friday evening UK time , nobody is answering this one either ie. writers or commenters)

    From article ‘NEO – Cold Case…MH17 faint echos of KAL007 Shootdown’ – 23/07/14

    ‘……The passports of the doctors have been recovered. They were [according to mainstream media] not in the clothing of their bodies but in a separate box, all together.

    If there is some sort of procedure for collecting the passports of a particular group of passengers during flight and putting them together in a separate box, it must be buried very deep in the Malaysian Airlines manual……But it does conveniently show, in the event of a fatal crash, that not just one but a whole group of doctors died together in the line of duty, and advances the narrative well….’

    (From me – comments section)

    ‘….Do we know the actual number of doctors’ passports that were recovered and that they were definitely all doctors? Or were they delegates to the conference, some of whom were doctors?

    As with Michael Shrimpton’s article which flagged up the significance of this AIDS conference, I am still trying to reconcile the statements here with the press statements from the conference itself, which repeat that 6 delegates were lost on MH17 (and names them) out of 12,000 delegates in Melbourne. Are we saying that there were many more than that and the press statements coming out of Melbourne are deliberately false / simply mistaken?’

    Any further thoughts on this one? Serf.

    • Serf, everything about this MH17 crash is crazy. So maybe the 6 AIDS people were NOT on that plane, but are all alive somewhere, working on a secret project? Since so much else is faked, and family not allowed anywhere near the bodies, identification of bodies will be difficult. DNA tests can be faked.

      And what is up with that military exercise in the area, Rapid Trident?

    • Re your post to me further down JS, I am not discounting the Aids connection out of hand, which is why I was careful to say ‘at present’ in my comments below. I am (for all practical purposes) discounting the figure of 100 quoted in the Guardian as being the possible number of delegates on that plane. I did point out on the Dennis / Jim article in the last day or so, that Dr. Lange was highly significant in the field of Aids research. Who knows ? Maybe he was going to blow the lid on a DVD connection that Mr S hints at in his article and they needed to take him out – speculation again.

    • As I see it, (with apologies if I am misinterpreting writers’ positions on here) we have the following

      Gordon – look at Israeli security influence at Schiphol and that there was likely a bomb on that plane.
      Dennis / Jim / Harold – look at the possibility that the plane didn’t even leave the airport (cancelled) and that this is a hoax with possible MH370 connections.
      Michael (initial analysis which I am sure will be updated when he is ready) – plane could have come down from a missile, much more likely fired from within the Ukraine as it is stretching the limits for it to have come from inside Russian borders.

      So I think at present

      It ain’t the Russians (absolutely no way). The Russians know exactly what happened and so do the Americans. The telling thing is this Rapid Trident exercise – stinks to high heaven of a drill / exercise covering a false flag. MH370 connection ? Possibly, but I am really waiting to see if Mr S is willing to move in the direction that there are other possibilities other than a Chinese shootdown.

      America is going down rapidly and the Dennis / Jim article yesterday, when combined with Gordon’s article about nukes in the US and the power grid (14th July) are persuasive.ie. everything that is happening (Gaza / Ukraine) is connected and we are heading for a really huge event in the not too distant future, of which all this is the precursor.

  8. I wonder which company will profit massively, if the whole of asia decides it must be law for all their planes, to be fitted with proper tracking/radar equipment ?

  9. BBC NEWS Police investigating sexual abuse allegations at a school in Rochdale have referred themselves to the independent police watchdog over the way they handled previous inquiries.

    Thats right folks – the police, rather than do their sworn duty, have taken the unusual step of reporting themselves, for failing to do their duty !

    They would rather grass themselves up to the IPCC, than do the job they are paid to do !

    Why ?

    Because there’s more chance of them getting prosecuted by the pope, than there is by the IPCC !

    So, rather than admit to any wrong doings, or deny it (when its so undeniable), they have decided that their BEST CHANCE OF GETTING AWAY SCOTT FREE, IS IF ITS DEALT WITH BY THE IPCC (Independent police complaints commission), because it is SO rare for thier investigations ever to go anywhere, that this turns out to be the best bet for bent coppers – put it in the hands of the IPCC !

    They will whitewash it, and tangle it up in so much red tape, that its like a “get out of jail free card”, fo rany of the paedo police involved !

    The system is crumbling under its own weight – it can no longer support the pile of filfth that it holds up, as good deeds !

  10. Michael, in your next article I (along with a number of other readers) would be grateful if you could spend a little time (a few paragraphs) to explain why you so strongly discount the possibility that MH370 may have been hijacked, or indeed any other possible explanation other than the plane (allegedly) having been shot down by the Chinese. I am sure readers appreciate that intel analysis is a constantly evolving process (and the confidential nature of much of the source material), but it would be most helpful if you addressed some of the other possibilities and why they don’t stand up in your opinion. Many thanks, Serf.

    • He mentioned what the satellites saw, mentioned it several times. So that’s probably the main reason.

    • My point JS, is that Mr S almost stands alone in his view about a shoot down of MH370, or if he doesn’t then he is one of the few who has stood up from he start and voiced his analysis. He has also stuck to his opinion on it throughout. All of which does not mean that Mr S is wrong by by means – and as you say, that could be related to the SATINT he has seen.

      At the same time, we have various other positions here on VT among writers and commentators. The latest from Harold is that MH370 was almost certainly hijacked and may now be connected to the MH17 disaster (photo evidence of the wreckage doesn’t match up).

      So who is moving in the right direction here on VT ? Over to you Michael !

    • Yes, after your first comment on this, i went and had a look

      http //www.veteranstoday.com/2014/07/22/malaysia-missile-strike-was-it-mh-17-or-mh-370/

      Curiouser and curiouser.

    • Yes, he’s not actually stating it as a theory – it is either fact, or he is wrong.

      The fact is,it was shot down by a chinese sub, which was in turn shot to bits by a load of Americans in a giant upside down bath tub !

      Or he was wrong. But he says thats whats available on the satint – so what you need to do, is get someone to show satint fo rthat place, on that day, with no planes blowing up, and you’ve proved him wrong. Even Obama could do that, and yet he wont !

    • Or i suppose you could just show a photo proving that MH17 was actually MH370, given a quick service, then dropped with all the rotting bodies on board, to Ukraine ?

      But then someone stole all the passports and clothing of all the alleged victims, and threw it round the crash scene, to make it look like they were dutch ?

      Surely it would be easier to actually just blow up the proper MH17 ?

  11. Harold’s Saive’s post of today pretty much proves that the tail section found at the site did not match the rest of the fuselage for MRD, which was the plane flying MA17, supposedly. interestingly, it did match the lost MH370 flight, plane MRO.

    be sure to read it, Mr Shrimpton.

    joe

  12. From the Tap Blog

    Hett asks Anonymous said…

    Has BARBIE Got a SECRET?

    http //www.veteranstoday.com/2014/07/19/the-mh17-shoot-down-over-ukraine/

    • mydog sometimes I get things back-to-front.

      Dyslexia, or something like that,

      I had asked my questions here of the editorial team at VT re the use of that hideously sexualised Barbi doll….
      and when I went over to the Tap Blog, Hett asked that question about Barbie having a secret.

      So, I do not know which came first.
      Maybe HETT saw the doll plus my questions at VT
      and posted the whole thing in a new way at Tap/

      It really does not matter in this case
      US has the Franklin scandal
      UK has more than we can say, here

      and Australia is doing its damnedest to keep a lid on the same

      shock! horror! 7 children have been found to be sexually abused in state care
      a 32 year old male in South Australia is charged

      and all the politicians and bureaucrats are ‘shocked and aggrieved’ blah blah

      This is not news, and 7 is ???? (what did I say previously?)

      I have always said that a few pathetic priests and aged celebrities are the tip of the ice berg.
      So don’t waste time or energy on links and urls mydog-
      we are on the same wavelength

      while ‘they’ create murder and mayhem.

      Peace be with You

    • Ani, you know one thing the bbc NEVER say ? They never say ” a 32 yr old GOVT WORKER” was arrested for abusing children.

      And yet, just about ALL of those running and taking part in this (and certainly those who are PROTECTING it), are govt employees (or their close minions). But the BBC just doesnt feel that worth mentioning.

      After a while, they did start referring to Asian paedo gangs, as being a specific phenomenon.

      But they’ve never once said “jack the govt employed paedo was today arrested for…..”

      THAT you see, is the common link in INSTITUTIONALIZED PEDOPHILE RINGS. The big ones, the highly organized ones, the ones with menus. They are run by the govt, for the govt, and their victims are any poor children, who for one reason or another have been detached form their families, and are at their most vulnerable. While we’ve all been dreaming that they are well looked after (because the govt looks after its employees so well, with all their money and nice uniforms – we IMAGINE it will be the same for the kids).

      Instead, they are trapped behind steel doors, and sold to the local children dealers, who in turn are protected by POLICE !

    • By the way, did you notice my name changed back ? I tried to log in, and it only remembered my old name and password, and it let me log in. but i cant get into the other one, now.

      By the way, i meant is it the wrong URL because its the url of THIS page, not to another site.

      I thought you were putting a link to hett.

  13. A worthy comment from Anonymous at the Tap Blog.

    Anonymous said…
    Here is another clue, SERCO will be involved in the incident.
    Rupert Soames is the head of SERCO.
    Nicholas Mycroft Soames a former UK Minister of Defence, is involved with MH airlines.
    Mycroft Holmes is the airline MH.
    SERCO are involved in airline bookings. SERCO were involved in fraudulent Tag claims, nobody went to prison, after millions of pounds were claimed fraudulently.”

  14. Well I never!

    Albeit at much greater length. Mr Shrimpton tells things much like I did in a few comments on posts by Mr Duff and Mr Dean.

    Mr Duff accused me of “showing off”, but lets Mr Shrimpton elaborate on the points I made about the BUK SAM System and neither the Russians, nor separatists being involved with MH-17.

    I was not “showing off”, I was just proving information which neither Mr Duff, nor Mr Dean had, e.g. the structure of the BUK System and who could deploy it,

  15. Further to my comment of July 19th, the AIDS conference has been up and running in Melbourne for several days and the conference website have issued several press statements on the MH17 downing. They maintain that the number of delegates on that plane was 6 and have confirmed that the total number of delegates is around 12,000 (not 14,000 as previously stated in the UK Guardian). Only one or two of the 6 could be classed as medical scientists by the look of it. So I’m not buying the AIDS connection at present – unless someone is trying to use the MH17 and AIDS conference connection to attack Putin’s stance on gay rights – again extremely tenuous. The website is at ****www.aids2014.org****

    • Elsewhere on the Internet, it’s been stated that Dr. Joep Lange could have been a high-value target all by himself, so I wouldn’t dismiss the AIDS angle just yet. Terrorists are willing to kill 300 people to get just 1 person; it’s been done before. There also could have been other people aboard, or cargo, that was high-value.

  16. *****http //www.youtube.com/watch?v=iTgXln4N9iY*****

    Fatima Dyczynski – CEO and Director, Xoterra Space, visionary for Nano Satellites. She bears a very uncanny resemblance to Maria Orsic of the Vril the psychic Vril worshiping woman from the Thule society.Plus she favors that infamous painting of the Nordic. Same everything, including the nose. Fatima has a few more pounds however.

  17. You are SO wrong about your dandy Prince Philip. But you know this. Your use of the sick Barbi photo at the top of your piece marks you as ‘in the club’. Bravo.

    • Whilst they submit written pieces for publication on VT, I’m pretty certain that the authors of articles actually have no control of the imagery used or indeed the titles for their work Mike.

      Also, the above comment response by Mr S on Prince Philip could read as to imply that I had made those accusations about the Prince in a previous article – which I didn’t, somebody else did.

  18. Nancy l Bisset I believe that Michael, the barrister, selected that Barbie himself. No idea why.

    I am joking again, I think. but it’s a rational question. better a rubber duck, or Schmoo.

    joe

  19. A couple of ways to look at this incident>

    The obvious > A new Lusitania? > a covert attack on a passenger plane instead of a passenger liner to incite another world war? A parallel already drawn in this Australian article –
    http //www.theaustralian.com.au/in-depth/mh17/downing-of-mh17-compared-to-wwii-submarine-attack/story-fno88it0-1226994095097

    The not so obvious > a way to ultimately curtail/shut down air traffic altogether?!!! Hmmm – why would that be necessary? (And I’m pretty sure I just flashed by comments either here on VT or other website of persons expressing NO desire to fly again!)

    HINT > plasma electromagnetic phenomena

    And about that Carlos guy > a convenient plant to convey/affirm the ‘shot down by a missile story’? That suspicion already being explored on Pressimus (only one link allowed).

    Plasma EM phenomena > only the TRUTH will set us free.

    [Attempts to post this to another MH17 article went up in ‘smoke’ – you might even say ‘shot down’ – but smoke and mirrors IS the name of the game!]

    • quote
      You wanna end this madness?
      Then start a DO NOT FLY campaign on the internet.
      I am already preparing it.

      Jim Morrison comment from Duff’s article – verry interesting!

  20. Yep, something important must be going on in the world, becaise this one single plane shoot down, is taking up every second of every news channel, everywhere, and no other news is allowed.

    And it happened right in the middle of “anti-govt paedo week”, where the news actually appeared to be interested in helping to expose and stop institutionalized pedophile rings.

    Come on people, dont lket them make these 300 dead bodies, more important than thousands upon thousands of children, being abused, up and down the country.

    Its one plane, and there’s nothing hardly anyone on here can do about it. But you CAN stop people from murdering children, in your own city !

    Come on govt and police – or have you been turned ?

    • language of mp’s etc. is getting harsher.

      Are they going to do a “reichstag” on russia, or will the DVD finally be exposed ?

      If the DVD get exposed, its gloves off, and probably the begginign of major conflict.

    • mydog I very much doubt that the individuals who make up the DVD will ever be exposed to us common taters.

      They destroy each other/themselves

      and the people who think they are in control
      eg Rupert Murdoch

      issue instructions to his ‘editors’
      ‘remain silent’
      e.g. one of the Rothschilds who was found hanged

      in a Paris bathroom, if I remember correctly.

  21. So, It’s the Germans we have to worry about? IMO, the Germans, Vietnamese and Palestinians are the most forgiving people on the face of the earth after what has been done to them by the Jews. Is that why Mr Shrimpton gets to advertise, because he can’t bring himself to say the J word? Truth be told. Tell the truth.

  22. I think Jonathon Pollard was a DVD agent.

    The DVD moved its offices from approximately 52° 31′ 0″ N / 13° 24′ 0″ E to approximately 32° 4′ 4″ N / 34° 45′ 53″ E.

  23. “The victims want to be avenged. I can guarantee you that, as I can that this will have again if we do not take care of business.”

    What on earth are you trying to say editors at VT?

    Sounds a lot like a Jim Morrison rant.

    • My question was/is-

      question intending to mean?

      “I can guarantee you that, as I can that this will have again if we do not take care of business.”

      This is an English speaking, respected Journal read internationally, so I see and understand the need for good proof editing. Otherwise readers are wreaking their brains trying to get the accurate meaning.

  24. We do not know who fire the missile that took Malaysian flight MH17 down, all we know is what the MSM is telling us. The Ukrainians could benefit by a Black Flag Op to put pressure on Putin to stop supporting the “separatists”, and World Bankers position of power would be enhanced if they could get rid of Putin and blame it on one of his own surface-to-air missiles. The ones would benefit the least would be the separatists it seems to me.

    http //carolinacowboy.wordpress.com/2014/07/19/1178/

  25. Please could someone explain to me the photo of the blonde doll at the top of this article? I find it disturbing in the context of this crashed plane, at the same time as the pedophile scandal erupting in UK, with certain male politicians being made redundant, with the stated reason of ‘making room for women in politics’.
    As if all that is not overwhelming, many of us are devastated to see photos of real children crucified in Gaza.

    So all in all, the scene is sick and sickening.
    VT editors-What is the meaning of that picture at the top of Mr Shrimpton’s essay?

    • she is not just a doll
      she is a sexualised doll
      in a sexualized pose

      like Barbie

      You know that song?

      “You can brush my hair
      undress me every/any where”

      while the world wonders what happened to Jon Benet
      and Madeleine McCann

      It is really sick.

    • http //youtu.be/ZyhrYis509A

      Famous last words, defining gender politics a la Aqua (they got it right!)

      Ken- “Hey Barbie, ya wanna come for a ride?

      Barbie-“You can touch
      You can play
      If you say I’m always yours’

      Universal Truth- “Imagination
      that is your creation”

      However, only one tribe is exploiting/capitalizing on this

      and I want to know-

      who, and for what reason, put that photo of a sexualised and very dead but smilingly smug Barbie doll at the top of Mr Shrimpton’s essay?

    • Ken- “kiss me here
      kiss me there
      hanky panky
      wink wink”

      I never checked into the making of that video; in that era, I saw it for what it was-pink, plastic, fantastic and stereotypically shallow/polarised sexuality.
      Today I see it as something far more serious and complicit in universal evil.

    • Yes mydog

      I have returned to Mr Shrimpton’s page numerous time
      and each time
      felt shivers

      from the top photo of sexualised/happy-but-very-dead-blond-doll
      to the next

      CEODirector Xoterra Space
      visionary of Nano Satellites
      R.I.P

    • Actually, i wonder, is it a case of WHO was on the plane ?

      Did they take the opportunity to whack this young lady, and just blame the ruskies ?

      Am i being thick ?

  26. ‘the Germans raped the Dutch in WW2?….didnt the Dutch have the largest VOLUNTEER units that worked with the Germans in WW2?’

    Huh tool? What makes you believe this?

    I am caring for my aged Dutch parents. I have grown up in the shadows of their stories. To this day, they will not listen to me on what really happened.

    But on this Mr Shrimpton is 100% correct the Dutch were raped.

    And I suspect that the Dutch Queens (still sounds like perversion & deviancy) who descended from William of Orange, their German consorts and their Jewish banksters ALL one way or another betrayed their own peoples. As did the British royal relatives.

    I am nowhere in Mr Shrimpton’s league when it comes to military intelligence. However, I do know something about family histories, existentialism and psychodynamics.

    My father was forced into Hitler’s labour camps. Did his best to escape numerous times. Other friends here were not so lucky. Went into hiding in Friesland, were caught and sent to the concentration camps.

    A really good book is Corrie ten Boom’s The Hiding Place. I cried from cover to cover, as my early childhood was lived on the other side of Haarlem from her home. Harrowing narrative detailing the worst atrocities and the ultimate Human Spirit.

    • 1958-Mr Shrimpton states this is the year EEC took control of Holland.

      How apt.
      In 1958 my parents bought a most run-down little farm in a convict settlement. They both worked their proverbials off…and all the while, our Dutch relatives were sending Dutch magazines via sea mail, which took forever, but o how wonderful to receive.

      I grew up listening and reading, on quota systems. In the farming communities of both Holland and Australia, I was both curious and aghast to witness (as a powerless child) the politics and bureaucracies surrounding food production.

      Long story short- European farmers being paid NOT to produce, while mountains of butter went to waste….
      Brussels-is there any good there?

      Paedophile capital
      NATO capital

      In the beautiful and romanticised English film on the young Queen Victoria, we see desperate Leopold of Belgium (think Congo and Rwanda) brokering the meeting with equally desperate Albert of Saxe Coburgh (think concentration camps/apartheid in South Africa
      and the peasants are expected to bow and scrape, grateful for their bowl of gruel.

    • ani,
      Even English historian A.J.P. Taylor, who disliked N.S. Germany, acknowledged that the German invasions into countries like Netherlands, Denmark, and Norway, were indirect response to British actions. In any country that has been invaded, the local populations are going to be subjected to treatment they don’t like.
      NS Germany never wanted a war to their west. They were obsessed with defeating communism, which they correctly identified as Jewish control of the masses. Communism is alive and well today throughout most countries in the world. Most people just don’t recognize it, due to its shape shifting nature.
      I justify neither the invasion nor the treatment of the Dutch. It is ironic, however, that “Dutch” banking houses funded both Cromwell and William of Orange in order to replace Catholic anti-bank monarchs. William of Orange declared crowned 1689, James II defeated in Ireland 1690, Bank of England formed 1694. Pure co-incidence, of course.

  27. DAHBOO77’s clip exposing the FAKE ‘Donetzkers – We shot down MH17’ audio — it was put out BEFORE the plane was shot down!!
    http //www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=28MrASx-RiM
    or, Justin Raimondo, at AntiWar, (a shill site but we take it where we find it)
    http //antiwar.com/blog/2014/07/18/audio-proof-of-ukrainian-rebel-responsibility-for-malaysian-flight-downing-is-fake/
    Kudos goes to DAHBOO7.

    • [Reply to Ms MMb’s article, testing this page because hers is not working]
      Look at the language here. “illegals”. “Lawbreakers”. “Aliens”. This applied to a flood of kids whose life in the Guatemala/Honduras/Panama terror states created by Washington, whose choices are join a gang, or be killed by the police/army/drug cartels.
      And all MMB can do is demonise them. Then there’s the ludicrous allegation they’re bringing the thing the robber barons of Amerika can’t stand — SOCIALISM. I have news for you. The USA is on its knees precisely because it hasn’t got enough socialism, and Americans are already accustomed and accepting of poverty, at levels which my country will not accept.

    • TBH I can’t quite believe the stance on these kids.

      But we in Oz have a long tradition of being isolated.

      We were for almost 200 years the arse end of the known world.

      Now we are centre stage, or so it would seem.

      Any suggestions Simpsons Donkey, on how Australians might retain our sense of what is right for those of us who did it tough all these years?
      For a very long time, I have suggested that we would not have problems with so-called asylum seekers, if we were not tacitly involved with their ‘dispossession’ in the first place.

      99.9 % Australians just look at me-blank-eyed.

  28. With apologies to Jesus …

    Then said Jesus, Father, forgive the British; for they know not what they do.

    • well, You know stephanaugust, Jesus did have a great sense of humour
      He Loved the odd-balls
      the politically-incorrect anawim (powerless ones)
      and
      He Loved to play Surprise!

  29. Good point made by Joe Chuy-Medina. Don’t these missiles leave a trail leading from the launch point up to the target? Wouldn’t that trail hang around and be captured on video?

  30. Add a comment..I saw this information last night about the AIDS scientists victims…. what do you think?

    *Yesterday, it was announced Glenn Thomas and leading HIV researchers were killed in the MH17 plane crash in the Ukraine A “coincidence” or “fate” as Frank Schirrmacher called it? Or the targetted assasination of a network resisting the use of Ebola as a global bioweapon?

    http //birdflu666.wordpress.com/2014/07/19/who-spokesman-glenn-thomas-i-emailed-in-april-killed-on-mh17-flight-coincidence/

    Tks!
    Val

    PS someone told me that their is a dialogue with jane
    burgermeister on top of one of your article that is not lisible as it strech from one side to the other of the screen?

  31. At present, I am not sure about Michael’s ‘connecting of the dots’ with the AIDS 2014 conference in Melbourne.

    The Guardian reported that ‘….As many as 100 of the world’s leading HIV/Aids researchers and advocates may have been on the Malaysia Airlines flight’ but then went on to state…’Delegates to a plenary session held ahead of the Aids 2014 conference were told that email exchanges showed about 100 attendees were booked on the MH17 flight’

    In fact, a statement on the conference website is showing six, one of whom appears to be a scientist –

    ‘The names of those confirmed at this time by friends and colleagues on board flight MH 17 are

    Pim de Kuijer, lobbyist Aids Fonds/STOP AIDS NOW!
    Joep Lange, Professor of Medicine, University of Amsterdam and Scientific Director, Amsterdam Institute for Global Health and Development
    Lucie van Mens, Director of Support at The Female Health Company
    Martine de Schutter, Program Manager Aids Fonds/STOP AIDS NOW!
    Glenn Thomas, World Health Organisation
    Jacqueline van Tongeren, Amsterdam Institute for Global Health and Development’

    I must sincerely say requiescat in pace to all victims of this appalling atrocity. However, there were a reported 14,000 or so delegates for this conference and so, unless one of the victims was about to come up with a revelation along the lines of DVD bio-weapon involvement as in the article here, then the connection seems to me a little tenuous.

  32. I feel that the ‘text above comments’ only purpose is to feed someone’s ego “they should ask me, this would not happen”.. wth

    For your info pro-russian separatists are in fact mostly Russian soldiers, not citizens of Ukraine, their leaders are covert GRU agents and were supported with arsenal transported to the region from Crimea, including several BUK systems with trained crew. Because of diverting the plane from its original course and the escort by military jets all the way until Donetsk, my opinion is that someone at top level just used the intel that separatists got BUK there against them. To show them as international terrorists, forcing Russia to stop its support and back off – as well as corner Mr. Putin for good. Knowing that the Donetsk and Lugansk regions are rich for natural resources and the land is already sold, it should be not so hard for you to find out who are the buyers.

  33. I believe that the bodies discovered from this current flight are from the ‘other’ Malaysian flight that disappeared …according to the Igor Girkin, pro-Russian rebel commander, the bodies from this flight were
    …”drained of blood and reeked of decomposition.”

  34. If you want to know who did it, just look at CNN and Fox and know that the truth is is just the opposite of what is being shoved down the public’s mental throat. Look at what McCain or Kerry are saying and do the same. This simple geometrical formula allows one to perform the most difficult of calculations.

  35. Try looking up Spainbuca, the air traffic controller, and what he saw, before that info disappears from the Internet.

  36. Malaysia Airlines (MAS) is 70% controlled by a bank called Khazana Internasional which finances much of the Malaysian government. Somehow the word “Khazana” doesn’t sound too Malaysian to my ears.

    This bears more investigation.

    http //www.airlineleader.com/regional-focus/airasia-mas-alliance-could-lead-to-more-strategic-changes-across-asia

    • Khazana apparently does quite a bit of business with Turkey, too. Has a corporate logo that looks like a mutated Star of David…….. Hmmm…….

      http //www.khazanah.com/docs/140417%20Press%20Release_Khazanah%20Investments%20in%20Turkey%20underscore%20strong%20bilateral%20and%20commercial%20relations.pdf

    • Malaysia does not recognize Israel, as we know. Also supported Palestine’s admission to UNESCO. Strong Muslim country, too.

      Sounds to me like the usual suspects are voicing their displeasure with Malaysians.

  37. Would Jonathon Pollard be one of the DVD assets who had infiltrated and passed on technical information to the “Soviets”?
    When did the DVD headquarters move from approximately 32° 3′ N, 34° 46′ E to approximately 52˚ 30′ N 13˚ 25′ E?
    Was A.J.P. Taylor wrong when he wrote that German expansion of the war into countries like Holland, Denmark, and Norway, was a direct response to British expansion of the war?
    Are others at VT off base when they state that Schiphol Airport has an Israeli company providing security and the airport is considered a Mossad controlled area?
    Is it a co-incidence that “Dutch” banking houses funded Cromwell and “Prince” William of Orange to overthrow British monarchs?
    Was the German Federal Constitutional Court wrong when it ruled – “It is upheld that the German Reich has outlasted the collapse of 1945 and has never gone under or fallen, neither through capitulation nor through the exertion of foreign state authority in Germany by the Allies, nor in the later course of time; it still is an entity with legal capacity, even though it is not fully operable as a government due to a lack of organisation. The Federal Republic of Germany is not the successor of the German Reich.”?
    Do the words “exertion of foreign state authority…” and “Federal Republic of Germany is not the successor of the German Reich” means that the current German government is a government of a foreign state?

  38. john marsh
    2 minutes ago
    https //www.youtube.com/watch?v=RyxIiW9m2mM
    Where is the smoke trail of the missile intercept? where is the smoke trail of the aircraft coming down? how did the camera operator know where to point the camera for several minuets before the explosion? where is the Aircraft descending seconds before the explosion? “this is a video of a ground explosion nothing more!”

    • This is an interesting take on the whole sorry scenario………..

      https //therearenosunglasses.wordpress.com/2014/07/19/was-crashed-malaysian-jet-carrlying-infected-corpses/

    • I should imagine there’s a lot of filming going on round there. Perhaps the guy only started filming after he saw a thingy fly up and hit a plane ?

  39. observation/ the first thing i noticed from the video of the smoking crash site was the long streamers slowly floating to the ground. i was amazed that no one on CNN even made comment of them. it was such an obvious thing , one would have to omit the observation intentionally . i have later learned that this material was chaff, usually associated with a fighter jet trying to shake missile guided radar etc. what fighter jet? why was it over the crash site? not sure if its true but seems reasonable.

    also the mobile missile launcher being shown on CNN in the rebel territory is perplexing? if you were trying to do this covertly, why would it not be covered by a tarp etc? why expose the missiles to the public unless someone wanted it seen? who benefits?? something stinks here?

    • Stock footage most likely. I worked in the TV biz, this stuff is slammed together by interns on workstations in an office in NY or Hollywood, then sent to The Big Jew upstairs for final “editing.”

      Don’t believe much of what you see, except that it’s always designed for the benefit of the usual suspects.

  40. Someone is obviously taunting Putin, no doubt the usual suspects behind the Kiev coup in the first place. To put it bluntly, the Jews who took over Ukraine did it, Putin knows it and now he will be forced to act or endure the humiliation of being boxed in by the “DVD” (read “Jews” by sane readers.)

    I guess we’ll find out soon if he’s the savior so many hoped for, or another zionist placeholder, like al-Sisi or Obama.

  41. Shrimpton – you are so British… for a Danish girl who learnt about the British taking all our lovely ships in 1807… … well let me tell you with this particular piece on 777 all is forgiven.. it is excellent… and your expertise… magnificent…. thanks – just for once I do agree with your 100%.

  42. what if you let Benton K. Partin Brigadier (Gen. USAF (Ret.) 8908 Captains Row AlexandriaVirginia 22308 703-780-7652) , look at the evidence and I am sure he will go along with you results.
    Here is his back round , after all he did say Oklahoma was no truck bomb and proved it along with 911 & Pentagon as well as other’s were not as the Whitehouse and media say.
    Military Command Pilot and Command Missileman with 4000 hours (37 combat.)
    Education
    B.S. Chemical Engineering
    M.S. Aeronautical Engineering
    Ph.D. CandidateOperations Research & Statistics (Academics Completed.)
    Publications/TV
    Sino-Soviet Conflict. Competition and cooperation Risks in Force Structure PlanningA Reduced Upper Limit for Sequential Test Truncation Error.
    Frequent TV Talk Shows on the Voice of Freedom.
    Honors
    Distinguished Service Medal
    Legion of Merit thrice
    Distinguished Graduate – Air War College
    A side not if I may , would not the steel at ground zero and the antenna in DC from the north tower have evidence , might take a court order or do you think it was sanitized .
    The Federal Building in Oklahoma and the Trade Center in New York (See New York Times October 281993p. A1) show evidence of a counter terrorism sting gone wrong.
    No government law enforcement agency should be permitted to demolish smash and bury evidence of a counter terrorism sting operation sabotage or terrorist attack without a thorough examination by an independent technically competent agency.
    If an aircraft crashed

  43. Michael, very interesting that you still push your ‘theory-without-a -shred-of evidence’ that 370 was “shot down,” and make the same assumption here, that M17 was shot down. Of course, Biden, McCain, Hillary say that, too. No photo evidence I have seen shows an exhaust trail from a Buk missile, and the video showing the so-called crash was obviously faked, by a guy who just happened to be focused on a spot in the distance. No plane trail in that one, either, until the fiery explosion of -what? fuel?

    MH370 may have wound up in Israel, and now may be “downed” in Ukraine -“downed” is what we believe, whether by on-board bomb or something else. If you are not familiar with Yoichi’s theories, you can find him at rense.com. Of course, read it with due suspicion, because the truth has not been found. Jimstone has some interesting theories, too, and comes with the same caveat.

    joe

    • Fascinating there by Hong Kong’s journo Yoichi Shimatsu, he says MH17 crash key is those rotting corpses, tied to major biowarfare labs based in Netherlands, & ICTS Israeli security thugs who run Amsterdam’s airport. Shimatsu says Israelis loaded MH17 with corpses, biowarfare agents which can kill millions, & a bomb set to blow in Malaysia. Shimatsu thinks the plot was discovered, & MH17 was shot down by a Nato fighter trying to explode and destroy the biowarfare genocide agents … but the missile failed to create a fireball, leaving Ukraine the perhaps new epicentre of mass genocidal disease death. Shimatsu thinks Putin knows all this. FWIW – http //www.rense.com/general96/dutch.html (insert colon to make link)

    • Jeee-sus. I wish this article on Rense “MH17 Hauled Gruesome Cargo In Infected Corpses And Tainted Blood ” didn’t make so much sense. A must-read, friends. http //www.rense.com/general96/dutch.html – paste this in.
      Quote “Besides the nearly 300 passengers aboard the ill-fated Malaysian Airlines, the plane’s cargo bay was loaded with dozens of infected corpses drained of their blood and countless packets of possibly virus-contaminated blood serum.. the shoot-down could have been an act of twisted heroism in a desperate last-minute strike to prevent biological warfare on a global scale.
      Before the zombie cargo escapes Europe to launch World War Z in Asia, top generals with NATO and the Russian command decide that the payload must be stopped at any cost. The passenger casualties tragic as they are, the loss of billions of innocent lives in an unstoppable global pandemic must be prevented..”

    • Thank you. OMG!
      As Jim Dean has indicated, if you do not make a stand now, these nutters will just keep on trying to kill us all.

    • Well said. I read Shimatsu’s rant, and noticed below it an interesting story on a 1994 crash in Holland where apparently, nuclear materials were being smuggled aboard the Jumbo that crashed.
      Just want to draw this to the attention of Uncle Gordy, Ian Greenhalgh & Co.

  44. The Flight 800 Investigation
    http //twa800.com/
    Information uncovered in early 1999 now shows that TWA Flight 800 could have been shot down by one or more shoulder-fired missiles. The FBI was briefed by military missile experts in the Fall of 1996 that Flight 800 was well within the range of a shoulder fired missile. The FBI conducted a covert dredging operation for stinger missile parts between November 1996 and April 1997. CDR. Donaldson brought this new evidence to the House Aviation Subcommittee in testimony on May 6, 1999. Unfortunately, the major media and the Congress are content to swallow the official line without question.

    • it was interesting to hear that anderson cooper on CNN the day of the downing of this plane made reference to the anniversary of flight 800 ” a flight that was also hit by a missile” ! did anyone else hear this comment? he later apologized for “mis speaking ” about 10 minutes after his comment. that was the last reference i heard to it.

    • She’s only another Jewess looking for a WAR!… These criminals can never get over the fact that they got their sorry asses kicked out of Russia after Yeltzins demise….now they want their American puppets to get them back home………..

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